Inspection 2 - Worth Going to BMW to Keep FBMWSH?
- Thread starter 620turbo
- Start date
abar121
Active member
Mr Tidy said:
That's true, specialist / main dealer wouldn't matter to me if buying.
Unfortunately as these attain classic car status, they will be bought more by collectors and investors, rather than car enthusiasts. A book with all BMW main dealer stamps is still desirable.
I've had equally bad / good service from main and specialist dealers. It's a crapshoot without personal experience / recommendations.
So, by way of an update, latest prices with me supplying the engine oil (TWS) are:
BMW Dealer £1,100 approx
ETA Motorsport £560 approx
It is a difficult one for the reasons everyone has posted above. If it were not for the Z4M transitioning into classic / collector status there would not be any doubt. I am sure that ETA will probably do a better job and are more used to working on them now than the stealers anyway.
I think I will give it to ETA but I hope the non BMW stamp in the book does not harm the car's value with someone at a later date. Thanks for all your input everyone.
BMW Dealer £1,100 approx
ETA Motorsport £560 approx
It is a difficult one for the reasons everyone has posted above. If it were not for the Z4M transitioning into classic / collector status there would not be any doubt. I am sure that ETA will probably do a better job and are more used to working on them now than the stealers anyway.
I think I will give it to ETA but I hope the non BMW stamp in the book does not harm the car's value with someone at a later date. Thanks for all your input everyone.
Liverpool
Even if the cost was the same, I wouldn’t take mine back to a dealer.
As long as the book shows a recognised specialist stamp, then the only people who’d worry about it are those anally-retentive, concours/original-at-all-costs type buyer who’d also want crappy Continental M3 tyres on it, and will have a fit when they find out that BMW have been filling it with the Shell equivalent of Castrol TWS.
Also, with as many dealership visits as me over 3 different M cars, I can tell you that you will only ever receive a feedback questionnaire if you’ve told the ‘service advisor’ that you were happy with what you’ve had done today. My ratio is about 1 questionnaire every 2 good visits, and 0 questionnaires after any bad visit. Unluckily for my local dealership, I had 2 visits in a week and one was good...until it required a return and turned into bad. So I got to give them a 1 rating that time (as it specifically asks you about your LATEST visit)
So it tells you something about their tactics if the only people they’re asking for reviews from are happy customers...even then, they’re only getting 4 to 4.5 stars out of 5.
As long as the book shows a recognised specialist stamp, then the only people who’d worry about it are those anally-retentive, concours/original-at-all-costs type buyer who’d also want crappy Continental M3 tyres on it, and will have a fit when they find out that BMW have been filling it with the Shell equivalent of Castrol TWS.
Also, with as many dealership visits as me over 3 different M cars, I can tell you that you will only ever receive a feedback questionnaire if you’ve told the ‘service advisor’ that you were happy with what you’ve had done today. My ratio is about 1 questionnaire every 2 good visits, and 0 questionnaires after any bad visit. Unluckily for my local dealership, I had 2 visits in a week and one was good...until it required a return and turned into bad. So I got to give them a 1 rating that time (as it specifically asks you about your LATEST visit)
So it tells you something about their tactics if the only people they’re asking for reviews from are happy customers...even then, they’re only getting 4 to 4.5 stars out of 5.
As others have said, it definitely wont to anyone who knows about these cars. Most cars around this age are always the same for me. I prefer to use reputable independents. Main dealers are only really geared up to service the current models / fleet and don't 'care' as much as the independents. I took my 996 turbo a main dealer once. They said they hadn't worked on one for 'a month or so'. It needed a couple of things doing on top of the service, which they were happy to do for £150 / hour!...no thanks!! With all the on-line reviews they have to be on the ball, know what they are doing and do a great job. A couple of 'nightmare' reviews could end up costing them money from any future work.
620turbo said:
"transitioning" :? have i missed a chapter :? if anything the last 6 - 12 months values (especially ZMC models) appear to be dropping back after climbing the previous 2-3 years
Could well see flatline figures for many years yet before the fabled "classic / cult " status often talked about actually happens
Is there a list in here of rated indies that we can rely on? I have only had my Z4MR since December. With only 22k miles on it I want to get it the best care possible.
In the future how much difference in £££ would the full dealer history make vs good indie history and frequent non mileage oil changes etc.
In the future how much difference in £££ would the full dealer history make vs good indie history and frequent non mileage oil changes etc.
I had this dilemma last year. Full bmw history on the Z. I had used a local BMW Indy for years and years on an old E46 so new them well.
So I phoned BMW for a quote and ask how long, and did the same with the Indy.
BMW said they could do it in a day (and that’s after been on hold while the reception spoke to servicing).
The Indy said two days and went into details as to why it must be 2 days for the inspection2.
After that and hearing so many stories of BMW not doing a full valve clearance check I went with the Indi. So glad I did as it was noticeably smoother.
I wanted my car to be services correctly, not half a job but with a nice BMW stamp.
I suppose it comes down to how much you trust your local BMW in comparison to your Indy.
So I phoned BMW for a quote and ask how long, and did the same with the Indy.
BMW said they could do it in a day (and that’s after been on hold while the reception spoke to servicing).
The Indy said two days and went into details as to why it must be 2 days for the inspection2.
After that and hearing so many stories of BMW not doing a full valve clearance check I went with the Indi. So glad I did as it was noticeably smoother.
I wanted my car to be services correctly, not half a job but with a nice BMW stamp.
I suppose it comes down to how much you trust your local BMW in comparison to your Indy.
North West Surrey
Striven said:
There is, but it isn't pinned so it's quite challenging to find it! :roll: Probably easiest to just start a thread asking for a good Indy in a certain area and someone should be able to help out.
As far as the OPs dilemma goes, I'd have gone Indy too - especially given the prices! My BMW Indy is ex-Sytner anyway, and at least one of his techs is as well so they probably worked on these cars when they were new.
Whereas the current techs in most main agents have probably never checked valve clearances.
620turbo said:
Actually, giving the car to a specialist, where you can name the mechanic working on your car, and that company and mechanic are well known, will increase the value of the car over a random dealer. People who buy these cars especially when they transition to classic status, look more closely at history. For example Phil at CPC is the only mechanic to have looked after my car for the past 6 years and he has done all services, vanos refurb, big end bearing, etc. I think a prospective buyer would value that more than "full BMW service history". Good job for making the right choice!!
mad4slalom
Senior member
mmm-five said:
I have been saying this for years, Main dealer servicing is the biggest con going. BMW are very evasive regarding what work is actually done during inspection one and two. They basically con you into spending up to a grand because the car has an M badge. The whole concept of sevicing a car as in the old days no longer exists, the “service” has become an “ inspection” , the name says it all, basically, look at it , and if it aint broke dont fix it, no cleaning of brakes and lubing caliper sliders, no checking / repacking wheel bearings or greasing suspension, you are lucky if they adjust your handbrake, at least you would think they would take that up a click or two just so it felt like there had been something done. Get to know a local independent and stress that you want proper preventive maintainance alongside proper servicing where some pride is taken ,Some dont even clean up oilspills from sump plugs and filter changess yet will get some schoolboy on a fiver an hour to grind grit into your prized paintwork as part of their customer service policy of free valet with every service. If you are a granny or a trusting or gullible person with no mechanical nonce though , the dealer will be quick to chuck away your perfectly good brakes and relieve you of five or six hundred quid because yours were below manufacturers spec madam !
Your car will be way better looked after by spending your cash on a couple of roll cabinets, stock them over a period with good tools , and fettle your b m with all the tlc that a garage in their pursuit of profit cant or wont do, have yr indy do the required inspections for your service history, do interim oilchanges yourself in addition to the stipulated ones, you will understand your car better, enjoy learning , have fun stocking up with tools and equipment, and increase yr cars value when a prospective buyer sees how anal you have been. Since I did this, its a pleasure to go to my tool chests knowing exactly where a particular tool is and knowing I have the right tool for the job. The added pleasure is showing my grandson these chests and their contents and what they do, watching him learn and experiment and explaining to him that when I am gone,all these tools and equipment are his and he too will be able to do his own spannering etc. I know this sounds negative and every mechanic in every main dealer
Obviously isnt a cowboy but they just cant, because of costs and time restraints give customers vehicles the time required to do the work properly. What did it for me , apart from many dissapointing experiences at various garages was reading on here that a bmw tech has 17 minutes to collect yr keys, find your car in the car park , bring it in and complete an oil service ! Nuff said
I suppose another argument to throw into the mix is if you have an insured warranty or not. I believe they want servicing done by dealers as per the schedule. Not trying to start a debate about if you should have an insured warranty but for some people that is probably something to be considered.
I would stick with a BMW independent garage just to ensure you get the BMW stamp in the book even if it does have independent after it. You need to use a well known reputable BMW independent garage rather than just some one locally known as being knowledgeable on the car. The reason being when you sell the car on the person purchasing your car may not be local and will be looking for the BMW stamp in some form or another.
If you're talking about the EU Block Exemption, then in this context - as it covers lots of motor industry stuff - it only covers the new car/AUC warranty as you had no choice in the terms & conditions of that agreement, as it was included/negotiated in the price of the vehicle.srhutch said:
With the 'aftermarket' BMW Insured Warranty you had the option of agreeing to any restrictive terms of this insurance policy, or finding a provider whose Ts&Cs your agreed with.
The BMW Insured Warranty (Mondial) I had actually stated that I had to use a "BMW authorised/approved service centre" - and besides the dealerships, I only found one 'Service Centre' (i.e. with no sales/service dept attached) in England...in Basingstoke.
The issue with not using the dealer on a new car, under manufacturer/AUC warranty, is the 'goodwill' element of any warranty claims you're trying to make. I doubt my 23,000 mile old engine claim would have been looked on as favourably had the issue appeared during an Insp.2 at any old VAT-registered garage (specialist or not)...I was just lucky that it was a BMW Dealer that had just finished the Insp.2 when the issue came to light.
I was really glad I took my MR to a well known independent specialist (Mark Purcell) here in Oxford when I did my first service since owning the car in Nov last year. Mark spotted a lot of problems and bodges that had been done, which ended up costing me over £3200. If I had taken it to BMW with their prices, the bill would have been over £5000 easily. I would have actually decided that the car was not worth saving and tried to sell it as spares or repairs, loosing myself well over the £3200 I spent on fixing it.
Mark had kept all the old/worn out parts that he removed, so I could see that all the parts he put on, were actually done. He also put the car up on the ramp and showed me everything he had done. Even though there was so many parts that had to be replaced (springs, shocks, brakes discs and pads etc) he informed me that I actually did have a pretty good car as then power/drive train was in excellent and the body was totally rust free and the only thing that I needed to sort out would be the right backbox/mid pipe as the flange had rotted off and the temp repair the garage I bought the car from was not of the highest quality (warranty claim).
It's this type of attention to detail and honesty that I find a good Indie garage offers above and beyond a dealership service centre is able to match.
Also in the past where my old man has taken his BMW's to North Oxford (the cars were between 2 to 5 years old and under warranty) they would often do things that seemed to pad out the invoice. I know they were always trying to claim the brake pads needed replacing, when he knew they were well within their service life.
Mark had kept all the old/worn out parts that he removed, so I could see that all the parts he put on, were actually done. He also put the car up on the ramp and showed me everything he had done. Even though there was so many parts that had to be replaced (springs, shocks, brakes discs and pads etc) he informed me that I actually did have a pretty good car as then power/drive train was in excellent and the body was totally rust free and the only thing that I needed to sort out would be the right backbox/mid pipe as the flange had rotted off and the temp repair the garage I bought the car from was not of the highest quality (warranty claim).
It's this type of attention to detail and honesty that I find a good Indie garage offers above and beyond a dealership service centre is able to match.
Also in the past where my old man has taken his BMW's to North Oxford (the cars were between 2 to 5 years old and under warranty) they would often do things that seemed to pad out the invoice. I know they were always trying to claim the brake pads needed replacing, when he knew they were well within their service life.