Implications of new 'M1' for Z4 35is??

MMM

Member
Whitby, North Yorkshire
Things seriously point to a new twin-turbo 1 series - 'M1'? - with 350hp and 'at least' 310lb/ft. And we know that we're getting a revised twin turbo Z4 35is with 335hp and 332lb/ft (temporarily overboosting to 369lb/ft). I don't get how these two engines sit together in the BMW range when they're so similar. Surely the 'M1' would/will have more than 310lb/ft?!? Why not just finalise one engine with say 350hp and 350lb/ft and put it in both cars and call the one-er a 135is?? Anyone else with a view????

Mike
 
I agree. I personally can't understand, engine wise, why they bought out the 35is? Why not just upgrade the 35i to the S spec for 2010 seeing as it's just an inter-cooler and re-map!?
 
I reckon the M1 could have more power than Autocar is suggesting - but the big thing is the setup on the car, not the engine. Lets be happy they're not (by the sounds of things) going to put a 4 pot engine in as earlier reports suggested, as that would just be crap!
 
I'm waiting for the Dinan software for my s35i rather than wait for an M series. 385hp 425ft lbs of torque. That's why I bought it last November.
 
One of the contractors at work here had the 335 with Stage 2 Dinan software and constantly told me about the GREAT fuel economy he had, much better than my M3 of course.( I had a quick glance at your link and see a lot of info about fuel economy and Co2 savings etc.) I wonder if the M1 will be as strong as previous M series motors. It certainly will provide enough jam. I'll read the link in depth and digest it a bit more later today.

I also factored in the "unknown when the M will be done" from BMW vs the "I want a Zed NOW" factor.
"NOW" won. I just couldn't wait......

It would be nice to see a few E89's with an //M badge. :D

Confused? I'm Mike too.
 
Wondermike said:
Hey Mike :)

The M1 is a single turbo engine N55 twin-scroll turbo which will replace the 35i engine eventually in the Z4 and 335i, but probably not until the facelift.

Mike,

I hear you mate, but I'm still a bit confused.... this from the Autocar feature on the 'M1':

"the new M car will use a revised version of BMW’s latest turbocharged straight six. In standard guise the 3.0-litre unit, recently unveiled in the 535i GT, uses a twin-scroll turbo aimed at providing a more linear delivery of power and better fuel economy than the earlier twin-turbocharged unit used in the 135i.

For the new M car the engine will re-adopt a twin-turbocharged layout, although the new system is said to differ quite dramatically from that used on the older engine; it’s likely to get a new turbo and a more efficient intercooler arrangement."


Which kind of contradicts itself somewhat! The above quote firstly indicates that the new 'M1' will have a tuned version of the twin-scroll SINGLE turbo engine in the 535GT, then says the 'M1' will 're-adopt a TWIN-turbocharged layout'..... and then the last bit talks about 'a new turbo' which could mean either ONE or TWO 'new turbos'!!

Then Autoblog state 'modified twin-turbocharged six cylinder engine' for the 'M1' at:

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/01/06/report-details-on-2011-bmw-m1-trickle-out/

So, no disrespect Mike, but I still aren't 100% sure! Where is your info from Mike??

Mike

As the Yanks say.... GO FIGURE!
 
Ah right sorry didn't have any concrete evidence, just saw twin-scroll in the text and put two and two together. I'd be amazed if they added another turbo to the N55 engine, what's the point.

:idunno:

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=337931
 
2 turbo's mean less lag whilst enabling more boost to be added to the bigger turbo. The new M engine's with turbo's really need to lag free with as sharp a response as possible.

I'm suprised they are going to the single turbo engines, but I guess it must be cost driven for the non-M cars.
 
The twin turbo in the N54 is not sequential but two small turbos both boosting three cylinders each. Not sure if any new engine like a twin turbo N55 would be sequential or not, seems to be out of favour currently.

The X6 is a single twin-scroll turbo so I'd be amazed if the M1 was any different.
 
Wondermike said:
The twin turbo in the N54 is not sequential but two small turbos both boosting three cylinders each. Not sure if any new engine like a twin turbo N55 would be sequential or not, seems to be out of favour currently.

The X6 is a single twin-scroll turbo so I'd be amazed if the M1 was any different.
Mike, is the s35i the N54, I heard a couple of times that it was sequential . ?
I'm not much of a gearhead, I just like driving them but it would be nice to learn something about my car from someone who does know.
:)
 
AH - you are right - however, a quick little read pulls up that with parallel turbo's - having 2 smaller turbo's does mean less lag, so I guess this would be the reason why.

Anyway - all speculation, I'm sure we will know within the next 6 - 12 months what it is... and perhaps what the Z4M will be - I'm still convinced they will do one!
 
mcbeee said:
Mike, is the s35i the N54, I heard a couple of times that it was sequential . ?
I'm not much of a gearhead, I just like driving them but it would be nice to learn something about my car from someone who does know.
:)
Not sure about being someone "who knows" but yep both turbos work on 3 cylinders each, which AFAIK is a better solution for a lightly blown engine like the 35i.

Few links

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_N54
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twin-turbo#Parallel_twin-turbo

csmith319 said:
...and perhaps what the Z4M will be - I'm still convinced they will do one!
Yep will be interesting to see what happens with that :D
 
Wondermike said:
The twin turbo in the N54 is not sequential but two small turbos both boosting three cylinders each. Not sure if any new engine like a twin turbo N55 would be sequential or not, seems to be out of favour currently.

The X6 is a single twin-scroll turbo so I'd be amazed if the M1 was any different.

Mike,

Only X6 30d is single turbo with variable vane geometry: X6 35i petrol, X6 35d & X6M are all twin-turbo...... :wink:

Mike
 
Hmm X6M has twin-scroll turbos but has two of them as well so using both techniques, maybe the M1 does the same, which would make the article read correctly.
 
Info released today



New twin-scroll turbocharged inline six highlights the changes

Woodcliff Lake, NJ – January 11, 2010… BMW’s EfficientDynamics philosophy continues with the 2011 135i Coupe and Convertible models which feature the company’s latest twin-scroll turbocharged 3.0-liter inline six cylinder engine. Both models will feature the 7-speed Double-Clutch Transmission (DCT) as an option.

The new six-cylinder (N55 designation) develops maximum output of 300 hp at 5,800 rpm, with peak torque of 300 lb-ft available all the way from 1,200–5,000 rpm. This is the same level of performance as the current 3.0-liter twin-turbo six-cylinder but with the innovation of twin-scroll technology and the integration of VALVETRONIC throttle-less intake technology, this new engine promises even better throttle response and even more fuel efficiency. Thanks to VALVETRONIC, VANOS, and the twin-scroll turbocharger housing, peak torque is reached 100rpm earlier than with the previous engine, and engine boost response is improved across the entire engine speed range.

In order to enhance the sporting character of the optional 7-speed Double-Clutch Transmission, the shift paddles now feature dedicated paddles for upshifting and down shifting. The driver now pulls the right paddle for upshifts and the left for down shifts. Manual shifts may also be accomplished via the console mounted e-shifter.

Harman Kardon Surround Sound System replaces HiFi System Professional as the upgrade sound system option.

The 2011 BMW 135i Coupe and Convertible will go on sale in the United States as 2011 models in Spring 2010.
 
Won't sound so good down the pub not saying you have a straight 6 3.0l Bi-turbo engine though! :P

Interesting they have done what they did to the facelift MINI and dropped the top end BMW system for a Harmon Kardon! The first gen MINI had the Harmon Kardon (I had it in my JCW'S) and that was a fantastic system in the MINI (the bass used the blur the door mirrors!!). They bought out the facelift MINI and dropped the Harmon system. Now they have it back again!!
 
Well facelift 3 series gets it too, so I suppose only a matter of time for the E89. Mmmm, a 335i Touring in non-M Sport guise sounds like a nice discreet Q-car.

Innovative engine technology on the top models.

The models right at the top also excel through outstanding efficiency ensured by innovative technology. The new BMW 335i Coupé and the new BMW 335i Convertible are entering the market with a newly developed straight-six power unit for the first time combining BMW TwinPower Turbo Technology, High Precision Injection, and VALVETRONIC fully variable valve management. Displacing 3.0 litres, the engine delivers maximum output of 225 kW/306 hp at 5,800 rpm, with peak torque of 400 Nm/295 lb-ft maintained all the way from 1,200 to 5,000 rpm.

The turbocharger system applying the TwinScroll principle with separate ducts for each set of three cylinders both in the exhaust manifold and in the turbocharger itself, and VALVETRONIC valve management now enhanced to an even higher standard, ensure a fascinating, direct response to the gas pedal at all times. Combining these features with High Precision Injection, the new power unit offers the muscle and performance of a naturally aspirated eight-cylinder with exceptionally low fuel consumption and exhaust emissions.

Acceleration from a standstill to 100 km/h comes in 5.5 seconds in the BMW 335i Coupé and in 5.8 seconds in the BMW 335i Convertible. Top speed is limited electronically on both models to 250 km/h or 155 mph.
Average fuel consumption in the EU test cycle is 8.4 litres/100 kilometres (equal to 33.6 mpg imp) on the Coupé and 8.8 litres (32.1 mpg imp) on the Convertible. The CO2 rating is 196 and, respectively, 205 grams per kilometre.

Efficiency and maximum power all in one: the BMW 335i featuring BMW TwinPower Turbo, High Precision Injection and VALVETRONIC for the first time.
The most powerful version of the BMW 3 Series likewise comes with an even higher level of efficiency in the 2010 model year: The new BMW 335i stands out in particular through the supreme muscle of its 225 kW/306 hp straight-six now combined more than ever before with a level of economy quite unique in this performance class. With power and performance remaining the same, average fuel consumption of the BMW 335i Saloon and the BMW 335i Touring is down compared to the previous models by approximately 8 per cent. This progress is attributable, among other things, to the introduction of a new generation of engines also in the BMW 335i. Indeed, the new power unit featured in the BMW 335i is the first engine to combine BMW TwinPower Turbo Technology both with High Precision Injection and fully variable VALVETRONIC valve management.

The new six-cylinder boasts a turbocharger system applying the TwinScroll principle to separate the ducts of three cylinders at a time both in the exhaust manifold and in the turbocharger itself. This particular configuration ensures a smooth and direct surge of power with immediate response even at low engine speeds, High Precision Injection interacting with newly developed multi-hole injectors positioned in the middle of the cylinder head between the valves and in the immediate vicinity of the spark plug for particularly precise dosage of fuel into the combustion chambers. To further optimise the development of power and the superior efficiency of the engine, fully variable VALVETRONIC valve management masterminds valve stroke and intake valve timing in an infinitely variable process. This reduces throttle losses in the charge cycle to a minimum and makes particularly efficient use of the energy in the fuel. And last but certainly not least, engine response is also even better, more dynamic and smoother than before.

The engine delivers its maximum torque of 400 Nm/295 lb-ft all the way from 1,200 – 5,000 rpm, and reaches its maximum output at 5,800 rpm. This accelerates the new BMW 335i Saloon from a standstill to 100 km/h in just 5.6 seconds (Touring: 5.7 seconds). Top speed is limited electronically to 250 km/h or 155 mph. Perhaps the most impressive point is that both models combine this sports car performance with a further reduction of both fuel consumption and emissions, with fuel consumption in the EU test cycle of just 8.4 litres/100 kilometres (33.6 mpg imp) on the Saloon and 8.5 litres/100 km (33.2 mpg imp) on the Touring, plus a CO2 rating of 196 grams per kilometre (Touring: 199 grams).
 
Is the M1 now being made? Will there ever be a new Z4M? Confusing!

http://www.bmwblog.com/2010/03/05/rumors-bmw-m1-not-happening-135is-instead/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
 
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