Hello - Newbie looking for a bit of advice - gearbox choice

[Argyll Andy]

Hi, joined the forum as I’m looking to buy a 03-06 3.0i soft top, not daily driver. Was a toss up between a 335i or Z4, the Z4 won!

I’m not asking the debated to death question about manual or auto.

I live in remote West coast of Scotland so no cars really handy to try so would like to narrow my search before travelling.

Main question is is there much real difference in mpg between manual and auto?

Would always have gone for manual as that’s what I’m used to driving and in a car like this would’ve been my go to but while searching over the last 10 days or so there’s a few autos drawn my eye, with spec, colour, mileage, history etc

Previously owned Convertible V6 Saab Aeros both in manual and auto guise and the auto consumption was worse than awful even though on paper not much difference. Z4 looks very similar, pretty much the same on paper, hence why I’m asking.

Any advice/experience greatly appreciated

Cheers Andy

 

[firebobby]

Welcome to the forum, my zed is an auto which I really like, the car becomes a beast when the mad (sports) button is pressed
I have seen 40+ mpg on a run but these cars are about having fun and plenty of hooning around.
Can't speak for the manual MPG, but it will be around the same mark
When you do get one, don't forget the photos

 

[Anonymous]

There were 3 ‘auto’ boxes

ZF 5HP
ZF 6HP
SMG aka sequential automated

Anecdotally the SMG boxes at this age can be expensive if/when they go wrong

The 6HP is technically a much better box, it’s fuel consumption characteristics is much closer to a manual than the 5HP which is more like a slush box of old

The 6HP is the first of the new approach that carries onto the 8HP mk 2 used in the G29

With fresh oil and filters they are generally trouble free.

Manuals seem to be a bit clunky on changes..some people complain a lot some don’t...

I’m sure others who are owners will comment..

 

[buzyg]

Welcome to the forum. Manual all the way on those lovely northern roads. It"s no Honda Civic, just a solid trouble free and great fun. :driving: experience

Happy hunting.

 

[Argyll Andy]

Thanks for your reply and welcome.

Have been reading a bit about both and am happy to see 40 mpg response. Not anticipating getting anywhere near that as this is exactly what this is for is fun and hooning around.

My main worry was that In the V6 9-3’s it could cost almost twice as much in fuel for the same run in the auto as the manual. When you’re giving it stick the difference was unbelievable. Never expecting a V6 to be frugal but brutal was a better description. Mid teens on a good day but the manual could touch 30. Lighter right foot might help right enough.

Just a general question, there seems to be a huge difference in price for very similar cars. Is this just extremely optimistic owners or are the genuine/proper price guides way out? (Autotrader/Whatcar/Glasses/HPI)

Seen a nice 03 3.0 manual private sale, around 45k FSH (not dealer) advertised at £5.5k, guides average says in excellent condition between £2800 - £3300.

But also seen a 53 3.0 auto in a dealer with sub 60k, FSH nice clean car with list of extras at £4K guides say £3400 from dealer. Given overall condition, extra spec and expected deal I’d see that buyable around the guide price.

I’m not shy in getting a deal, Nice car, would like to approach but looking at bidding £2k under asking for the manual if the guides are right and feel even for me that’s cheeky but also if there’s an accepted price structure out with straight book prices don’t want to look like a t*t

 

[Argyll Andy]

[ref]buzyg[/ref],

Thanks, see my automatic instinct is to go for manual, as said in a previous reply it’s more the choice of what’s out there that’s steering me towards auto and the price too. Seem to get a better auto for same money.

Yes, the roads about me are amazing. Main road at the end of my street is 40 miles to the next big town, Oban, and is in the top ten Uk roads for bikes and is equally enjoyable in something like a Z4

No, no Honda Civic for me. Only Honda I’ve owned was a Fireblade.

Daily is a 325i manual but need to keep a 4 dr 5 seater so the Z4 is my weekend car

 

[Argyll Andy]

[ref]Pbondar[/ref],

Thanks for that.

How do I identify whether it’s a 5 or 6?

Is it as simple as year of manufacture or is it something that could be spec’d at original purchase?

This is one of the ones I’m considering, I take it this will be a 5 given it’s one Of the earlier ones?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2003-BMW-Z4-3-0i-AUTOMATIC-ONLY-63947-MILES-MASSIVE-SPECIFICATION/333365748344?hash=item4d9e25a278:g:iH0AAOSwBGRdqQUP

 

[Anonymous]

Wiki has a good synopsis...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_Z4_(E85)

30si had the ZF 6HP box..other boxes on other variants..

 

[Argyll Andy]

[ref]Pbondar[/ref],

Spot on, that’s very helpful

Now thinking maybe should also be considering 2.5 Si as pretty close to earlier 3.0i.

 

[Mr Tidy]

The 2.5Si is a facelift model - just make sure you avoid the facelift 2.5i as it is only rated at 177PS. It seems to have been intended to replace the pre-facelift 2.2i.

The facelifts use a newer generation of 6 cylinder engine, the N52 which revs a bit higher.

It's a great engine, but has a couple of foibles. One is that there is no dipstick, you check the engine oil level using a button on the dash. The other is that it has an electric water pump which will fail at some point, and when it does the car will overheat in about a mile! Plus new pumps tend to cost around £250 - that's just for the part.

If you can live with some miles, this 3.0Si is cheaper than the 3.0is you've seen:- https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=41&t=117731

Happy hunting anyway.

 

[Argyll Andy]

[ref]Mr Tidy[/ref],

Thanks for that, never realised the difference.

On the 2.5 subject, seen quite a nice one advertised reasonably locally, 135 Miles!, and is advertised as a 2.5Si. Ran it through insurance/black circles etc to check the model after what you’d advised and it comes up just saying 2.5i whereas ran another one advertised through same and comes up as 2.5Si.

Contacted the seller and he says he “thinks” it is and is “almost a 100% sure” is there an definite way of identifying, does it specifically show on V5 or is there a site you can run the reg through that will confirm the model as an Si?

Thanks

 

[firebobby]

[ref]Mr Tidy[/ref],

Thanks for that, never realised the difference.

On the 2.5 subject, seen quite a nice one advertised reasonably locally, 135 Miles!, and is advertised as a 2.5Si. Ran it through insurance/black circles etc to check the model after what you’d advised and it comes up just saying 2.5i whereas ran another one advertised through same and comes up as 2.5Si.

Contacted the seller and he says he “thinks” it is and is “almost a 100% sure” is there an definite way of identifying, does it specifically show on V5 or is there a site you can run the reg through that will confirm the model as an Si?

Thanks

What year is it ?

 

[Argyll Andy]

[ref]firebobby[/ref], it’s a 2006, so right on the change as per a useful WIKI link Pbondar sent me in relation to my query about auto boxes.

Mr Tidy also pointed out the differences in 2.5i and 2.5Si so using that info tried to check the one I’d seen and the insurance says it’s just a 2.5i

To make sure that wasn’t how they appeared I just picked a random 56 plate advertised as a Si and ran it though the insurance and it did cone up 2.5Si in the vehicle description from the reg no unlike the other one.

Just don’t want to end up with the lower powered one.

 

[ph001]

Well the badge on the side will say either 2.5Si or 2.5i ! Unless of course some unscrupulous owner has changed the badges but that would seem a bit pointless

 

[srhutch]

[ref]firebobby[/ref], it’s a 2006, so right on the change as per a useful WIKI link Pbondar sent me in relation to my query about auto boxes.

Mr Tidy also pointed out the differences in 2.5i and 2.5Si so using that info tried to check the one I’d seen and the insurance says it’s just a 2.5i

To make sure that wasn’t how they appeared I just picked a random 56 plate advertised as a Si and ran it though the insurance and it did cone up 2.5Si in the vehicle description from the reg no unlike the other one.

Just don’t want to end up with the lower powered one.

It’s not uncommon for some folk to thing they have an Si model because they have Sport trim, that is not what the S stands for. It only relates to the engine.

Ask for the last 7 digits of the vin and run though a online vin checker, that will confirm.

 

[Argyll Andy]

[ref=#006600]srhutch[/ref], I think this is exactly what it is. It has Sports seats, steering wheel etc. so that’s what my original thought was.

I’ll see if I can get the Vin, if not a good enough indicator not to peruse. He doesn’t seem that keen to provide too much more information but saying that he’s got a random guy asking to him to provide detailed info, maybe he’s wary it’s a scam or something as I asked if I could have a copy of V5 etc to see if I could see from there. That would’ve given me the vin too.

 

[Argyll Andy]

[ref]ph001[/ref], hi, did check that, no badges on side at all. Not saying it’s done to deceive just not there.

 

[ph001]

Ah I see...some people do remove the badges, yes. Hmmm, that makes it more tricky. VIN is the only way to go I think as the engines look identical.