Goodwood Trackday - 19th October

Ed Doe

Ed Doe

Veteran
 Ashbourne or Frimley
Morning all,

After much procrastination, I finally got the Coupe booked in for a morning track session at Goodwood, which came round earlier this week.

I am a complete novice when it comes to track driving, having done one (awful awful) track slot at a Forge Action day at Castle Combe, and one prior experience of Goodwood when I was thrown the keys to a 4.0 GT3 RS for a couple of sessions.


I have to say I had an absolute blast! I was actually pretty nervous in the run up to the day - I was worried about a) crashing b) being crashed into, c) blowing the engine up, d) trashing my brakes and tyres and needing to then spend loads on them. I need not have worried, the car performed faultlessly, and was an absolute riot to drive fast! :D

To mitigate a little the risk of being left in a bad way if the worst did happen, I did purchase track insurance through MORIS. I would recommend for anyone considering getting on track to get some for at least the first few occasions - it gave me just a little bit more peace of mind when taking to the track...

If anyone is considering getting on track but is worried about how the standard car will hold up - don't worry, just get out there and enjoy it. My car has had some light modifications as per my signature, but I'd say even with decen OEM gear and a fresh alignment you'd have just as much fun (the standard auto coupe in front of me in one of the sessions was!). Don't make the mistake of spending fortunes on parts you think you might need to upgrade before trying the car as it is. I thought my brakes would need doing - they didn't they were absolutely fine for the first outing on track, and will probably be fine for at least another few days yet.

Technically, I think I would have had more consistent handling and a little less oversteer with Pilot Supersports on the rears too, instead of the Goodyear Eagle F1s. That being said, I think I'd have had just as much fun if I'd had Goodyears all round - it would have just brought the balance back slightly towards neutral, especially as the sessions went on.

I had the traction control in DTC, for the following reasons;

1. I'm a novice so did want a little safety net
2. With an open diff the oversteer tended to be quite scrappy when it came - without being able to properly and consistently catch it on the power with a locking diff, I'd rather just accept the DTC is going to slightly intervene for the timebeing.
3. I tried initially on the first run with TC fully on, it was awful - cutting power everywhere, so that got sacked off before the end of the first lap (not on camera)

The next thing I think will be a locking diff - off to discuss with Birds shortly....!!


Finally, I'd just like to say the excitement of the event definitely got the better of me, and I almost certainly babbled out an awful lot of absolute cobblers during the course of the following videos! Apologies in advance - I'm not as much of a clot as the commentary may lead you to believe!!! :oops:

Now, without any more witterings, below are the videos - I hope you enjoy watching them - I certainly enjoyed making them!!

Cheers

1st Session:
[youtube]https://youtu.be/JZ3tbnWRb9U[/youtube]

2nd Session:
[youtube]https://youtu.be/V_xkzZyJQwI[/youtube]

3rd Session:
[youtube]https://youtu.be/NO5PbKOutI8[/youtube]
 
Sounds good, although I can't see the videos on my phone. Do you have links instead?

What did Birds say initially, been waiting for your thread as promised a day or two ago? 8)

Can you give any more detailed feedback on the B12 vs standard as I'm also looking to change out my suspension. I can't decide between B12 or coilovers. I don't need any ride height drop so would always go for as small a drop as possible but I do like to play with settings. That said, if the B12 gets it right there's no need. Does it noticeably reduce the roll and pitch for example? I'm less concerned about comfort.
 
Steve84N said:
Sounds good, although I can't see the videos on my phone. Do you have links instead?
What did Birds say initially, been waiting for your thread as promised a day or two ago? 8)
Can you give any more detailed feedback on the B12 vs standard as I'm also looking to change out my suspension. I can't decide between B12 or coilovers. I don't need any ride height drop so would always go for as small a drop as possible but I do like to play with settings. That said, if the B12 gets it right there's no need. Does it noticeably reduce the roll and pitch for example? I'm less concerned about comfort.
Click to expand...

Hi Steve,
I've not had coilovers on the zed to be able to offer a direct comparison, however, my experience of coilovers on other cars vs the Bilstein set-up is that unless you're spending a lot of money, and really know what you're doing as regards setting them up, you're better off with a fixed damper like the Bilsteins. The Bilsteins are also in my experience more compliant in general than coilovers. They work better on the road, and still work very well on track. There is reduced roll over the OEM sport dampers, but if that's what you want to eliminate I'd suggest ARBs from H&R or similar. The Bilsteins really work when you start going fast and attacking, they keep the wheels in contact with the road, and make the car very compliant and transparent on the limit. That's my experience anyway :)

Basically, I can't say at this stage I would want more control over bump and rebound and spring-rates to justify the additional cost of coilovers, and I don't (yet) have the appropriate knowledge to set them up!



I've just got home from the gym, about to call Birds and final check the pricing etc. Half an hour I promise! :D

Links to the videos below :)

1st Session:
https://youtu.be/JZ3tbnWRb9U

2nd Session:
https://youtu.be/V_xkzZyJQwI

3rd Session:
https://youtu.be/NO5PbKOutI8
 
Excellent stuff - well done! I'm really pleased you enjoyed your first proper session on track in your own car, although it can be very addictive.

You looked generally smooth and safe in the videos, but your lines/concentration really seemed to suffer the more you talked. Try focusing on the road a bit more, and suppressing some of the excitement (not easy, I know).

What's next? Booking another day, or fettling the car?
 
DaveP said:
Excellent stuff - well done! I'm really pleased you enjoyed your first proper session on track in your own car, although it can be very addictive.

You looked generally smooth and safe in the videos, but your lines/concentration really seemed to suffer the more you talked. Try focusing on the road a bit more, and suppressing some of the excitement (not easy, I know).

What's next? Booking another day, or fettling the car?
Click to expand...

Thanks Dave, I agree, less talking, more driving..! :oops:
My two passengers are my best mates, and we'd been talking about getting out on track for yonks, so the eagerness to discuss stuff as it happened got the better of me occasionally :P I'm sure it'll be better next time.


Next is almost certainly a Diff, and then leaving it alone for the winter months. Brake fluid change, check-over, Inspection 1 and possibly new tyres slated for March/April time, followed by potentially another morning at Goodwood. This time with a tyre pressure gauge too - I need to keep on top of those to improve the longevity of the tyres as much as possible!

From there, I'm thinking of possibly doing Bedford, although I've always always wanted to do Anglesey... we'll see!
 
Ed Doe said:
DaveP said:
Excellent stuff - well done! I'm really pleased you enjoyed your first proper session on track in your own car, although it can be very addictive.

You looked generally smooth and safe in the videos, but your lines/concentration really seemed to suffer the more you talked. Try focusing on the road a bit more, and suppressing some of the excitement (not easy, I know).

What's next? Booking another day, or fettling the car?
Click to expand...

Thanks Dave, I agree, less talking, more driving..! :oops:
My two passengers are my best mates, and we'd been talking about getting out on track for yonks, so the eagerness to discuss stuff as it happened got the better of me occasionally :P I'm sure it'll be better next time.


Next is almost certainly a Diff, and then leaving it alone for the winter months. Brake fluid change, check-over, Inspection 1 and possibly new tyres slated for March/April time, followed by potentially another morning at Goodwood. This time with a tyre pressure gauge too - I need to keep on top of those to improve the longevity of the tyres as much as possible!

From there, I'm thinking of possibly doing Bedford, although I've always always wanted to do Anglesey... we'll see!
Click to expand...
Interesting. How do you think a diff might have helped you in that session? You looked like you were pretty smooth getting on the throttle, and didn't seem to struggle for traction. I'm just wondering if it's worth it??

Bedford is an excellent track, and highly recommended - nice and long (not too crowded) and plenty of variety. Make sure it's the GT layout and an open pitlane day, and you can't go wrong. I went on a Javelin day and had a great time.
 
DaveP said:
Interesting. How do you think a diff might have helped you in that session? You looked like you were pretty smooth getting on the throttle, and didn't seem to struggle for traction. I'm just wondering if it's worth it??

Bedford is an excellent track, and highly recommended - nice and long (not too crowded) and plenty of variety. Make sure it's the GT layout and an open pitlane day, and you can't go wrong. I went on a Javelin day and had a great time.
Click to expand...

There were a few moments where I thought I'd benefit - the TC continued to hold me back out of the chicane getting onto the power, and out of St Mary's into the dip running it out, although I do agree being smoother did tend to help a little. Mid-corner in Lavant, the car seemed to fold into slightly scrappy oversteer as the inside rear wheel unloaded. The TC kept it less pronounced, but I'd really prefer to be switching it fully off, so would like the additional control an LSD offers.

That's my reasoned understanding, but please do feel free to correct me if I'm barking up the wrong tree!

I nearly booked a Javelin open pit day in September at Bedford GT Circuit - I was put off by the fact there were 100 cars booked on, and that I didn't have any prior experience of the circuit. I felt I would be really out of my depth, particularly having seen how many cars tend to take to the track at once. Goodwood only permits up to 10 per session. It did work out a lot more expensive, but I think as a 'first experience' in my own car, I chose the right thing!

So do you do do a lot of trackdays? You certainly sound like you know your stuff :P
 
Ed Doe said:
[post]1348579[/post] There were a few moments where I thought I'd benefit - the TC continued to hold me back out of the chicane getting onto the power, and out of St Mary's into the dip running it out, although I do agree being smoother did tend to help a little. Mid-corner in Lavant, the car seemed to fold into slightly scrappy oversteer as the inside rear wheel unloaded. The TC kept it less pronounced, but I'd really prefer to be switching it fully off, so would like the additional control an LSD offers.

That's my reasoned understanding, but please do feel free to correct me if I'm barking up the wrong tree!

I nearly booked a Javelin open pit day in September at Bedford GT Circuit - I was put off by the fact there were 100 cars booked on, and that I didn't have any prior experience of the circuit. I felt I would be really out of my depth, particularly having seen how many cars tend to take to the track at once. Goodwood only permits up to 10 per session. It did work out a lot more expensive, but I think as a 'first experience' in my own car, I chose the right thing!

So do you do do a lot of trackdays? You certainly sound like you know your stuff
Click to expand...
Definitely don't consider myself an expert at all. I only started myself this year, but I've been tinkering with cars for a long time.

How come you didn't fancy doing it with the TC turned off? Was it not a bit intrusive?
 
flimper said:
Nice driving Ed, looked very good for your first track day. Quicker than me for sure :thumbsup:
Click to expand...

Thanks dude - you'd be surprised how quickly you find a rhythm with it and then start to really explore the car's capabilities - feels fantastic!! You must come along next year when I book another - I'll let you know when I've got the dates for 2017!

DaveP said:
Definitely don't consider myself an expert at all. I only started myself this year, but I've been tinkering with cars for a long time.
How come you didn't fancy doing it with the TC turned off? Was it not a bit intrusive?
Click to expand...

I see - I've also been tinkering for a few years too (hot hatches previously) with the intention of tracking, but never took the plunge until now.

So my understanding (and correct me if I'm wrong anyone who knows better) is that the DTC actually starts to apply the brakes when the wheels start to lose traction, so in effect it works similarly to a primitive e-diff, preventing the inside rear spinning when putting the power down. The downside of having it on is the tc is also on in the background - albeit in a less intrusive setting, which means that you can play to some extent with the car rotating with a lift or a bit of throttle, but it will intervene and cut power (as you can probably see if you look closely on some corners in my videos) when you start to want it to move about a bit more.... As you say, the natural progression at this point would then be to switch the lot off, BUT turning the systems fully off without an LSD means it's much much harder to catch any ensuing slide.

I don't think not having a locker held me back much, but I'd really like to be doing it myself, and there are definitely a few areas where I would have liked to have made the decision on how much oversteer I had :lol:
 
Good stuff Ed. I keep blowing hot and cold about doing a track day. I'd be interested in knowing more about the insurance; i.e. What it covers, what it costs etc. You can update me next time we meet. Like you I'd prefer to spend a little more to be on a track with few cars.

Are you going to Goodwood Breakfast Club on the 6th and/or to the Newlands Corner meet on 20th November? If so, see you then.
 
Well done ed

Next time you go drop me a message mate and I'll try and come down and say hello.

Did you have any instruction?

Ash
 
I'd recommend an MFactory LSD mate. Fitted one to mine and loved every minute

http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=59340


How much was your trackday and do you have a link.?

Cheers Chris
 
Rick I'd suggest just going for it and booking a morning! I'd be happy to book the same day and you can passenger with me for a session of it made you more comfortable :P I'll send you a copy of my policy details re the track insurance but its pretty straightforward stuff :) I'm definitely at hot hatch breakfast club, Petworth beforehand for a convoy? :D

Ash - thanks man :) I'll definitely give you a heads up when I book the next one - it's so addictive it's only a matter of time now haha :P I didn't get any instruction but I was fortunate in having had a couple of sessions in a 911 with the owner who had done a few days at Goodwood, so I picked up the lines fairly quick!

Chris - at the minute the Mfactory lsd is working out more expensive than the Quaife, partially due to the terrible exchange rate at the moment... Thanks for the info though :)
A half day at Goodwood is 170quid during the 'peak season' and 330 for a full day. As I said, it's more pricey than other tracks, but you do have far fewer cars out at once which definitely appealed to me as a novice!
 
Ed Doe said:
Rick I'd suggest just going for it and booking a morning! I'd be happy to book the same day and you can passenger with me for a session of it made you more comfortable :P I'll send you a copy of my policy details re the track insurance but its pretty straightforward stuff :) I'm definitely at hot hatch breakfast club, Petworth beforehand for a convoy? :D

Ash - thanks man :) I'll definitely give you a heads up when I book the next one - it's so addictive it's only a matter of time now haha :P I didn't get any instruction but I was fortunate in having had a couple of sessions in a 911 with the owner who had done a few days at Goodwood, so I picked up the lines fairly quick!

Chris - at the minute the Mfactory lsd is working out more expensive than the Quaife, partially due to the terrible exchange rate at the moment... Thanks for the info though :)
A half day at Goodwood is 170quid during the 'peak season' and 330 for a full day. As I said, it's more pricey than other tracks, but you do have far fewer cars out at once which definitely appealed to me as a novice!
Click to expand...

Thanks Ed. Yes - being the passenger seat with you would be great, as that would give me an idea as to lines, braking points, grip levels etc.

Shall we say a 07:15 meet in Petworth on the 6th for the Goodwood Breakfast Club? If you could bring a copy of the policy you got for the insurance, that would be appreciated.

Have you caught up with this threa looks as though there may be a run close to us on Sunday.

http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=91507
 
Thanks for your comments Ed, the B12 sounds ideal as mine is a daily as well as for fun. I already have H&R ARBs but am finding they are almost too stiff for the standard suspension as they cause too much load transfer with little resistance from the springs.

I've emailed Birds to hopefully get the offer you've negotiated...

Your description of DTC is spot on as far as I know and I've definitely noticed the same thing in terms of accelerating out of slow corners being better with it on. Not for much longer though. 8)
 
RickRob said:
Thanks Ed. Yes - being the passenger seat with you would be great, as that would give me an idea as to lines, braking points, grip levels etc.
Shall we say a 07:15 meet in Petworth on the 6th for the Goodwood Breakfast Club? If you could bring a copy of the policy you got for the insurance, that would be appreciated.
Have you caught up with this threa looks as though there may be a run close to us on Sunday.
http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=91507
Click to expand...

No problem, I'd be happy to have you along for a session :D You'll soon be as hopelessly addicted as I now am haha!

07:15 sounds good for Goodwood, and of course I'll bring the Insurance policy details for you. An awful lot of it is on the moris website though - http://www.moris.co.uk/ if you wanted to have a look there too.
I wont be available on Sunday - off to London for a flat-warming party this evening, and staying over, so wont be back until early-pm I'd imagine. Hope you have a good run though :)

Steve84N said:
Thanks for your comments Ed, the B12 sounds ideal as mine is a daily as well as for fun. I already have H&R ARBs but am finding they are almost too stiff for the standard suspension as they cause too much load transfer with little resistance from the springs.
I've emailed Birds to hopefully get the offer you've negotiated...
Your description of DTC is spot on as far as I know and I've definitely noticed the same thing in terms of accelerating out of slow corners being better with it on. Not for much longer though. 8)
Click to expand...

No worries. For me, I think the B12 kit is the perfect compromise anyway :D You shouldn't be disappointed!

I think I'm prettymuch sold on the Quaife unit now with Birds - just need the final seal of approval (roll of the eyes, shrug, "if you really need it then I guess so") from the wife :lol: then I'll be booked!
 
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