Engine missing when cold?

samZ4M

Active member
 Oxford
As it's getting colder, this problem seems to have appeared. If I jump in the car and head out, going through gears it hesitates, or misses. It's a 30 speed limit, so im not gunning it. Best way to describe it, it's either mis-fueling or firing on 5 cylinders for a tiny bit of time. The engine goes flat, as in, won't pull anymore for a second.

Once warm, it's fine, pulls well and doesn't show any of these traits.

thoughts?
 
Ok, missing is probably an over statement. But it's not pleasant. Unless you're full on, which I don't like doing from cold, it's flat and hesitates.
 
samZ4M said:
If I jump in the car and head out, going through gears it hesitates, or misses.

Try not jumping in - it could damage the seats and if you slip could explain 'going through the gears'
Never drive with your head out or you'll find it may not 'miss' everything :)

Aside and including that nothing much to add
 
samZ4M said:
Ok, missing is probably an over statement. But it's not pleasant. Unless you're full on, which I don't like doing from cold, it's flat and hesitates.

Mine's a bit like that. Think it's normal. The transmission is also a bastard from cold.
 
Very helpful cj, I'll try that next time.

Fair enough. Just didn't want a problem to develop.
 
You should hear an Alpina when it's cold - sounds like a bag of spanners....

Probably your engine asking you to be gentle with it, until its warmed up :)
 
For me that doesn't sound normal at all. Mine is fine when cold, obviously treating it with a bit of respect. No flat spots or misfiring here.
When was the car last serviced op? Could be the sign of a plug or coil on its way out?
 
Could be the well documented "hesitation" issue? http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=39891&p=1283277
 
Mine is the same when cold. I try to start the engine and leave it for just a few minutes before heading out, otherwise it's easy to kangaroo a bit and does feel a bit lumpy and like its 'missing'. Once its starting to warm up its fine.
Like others have said, it really doesn't like being cold, but then who does!
 
I had slight hesitation from cold for maybe the first 30 seconds.

Then over Christmas the camshaft sensor on the exhaust side died. I fitted a new one and the slight hesitation when cold has gone :D
 
Always let mine sit for a few mins before it moves
Especially when cold as gives oil time to round a good few times then drive slowly and let it warm fully
As box doesn't like it either
 
Letting it sit when cold before driving it is actually not the best thing for it as it stays colder for longer. Driving it gently straight away warms everything more quickly and it's when it's cold that more wear occurs.
 
^ I dont agree with that for the full 100%.
First of all its not cold that induces wear, its lubrication (or lack of) and differences in tolerances.
Secondly, forces when driving (even when driving gently) are in an order of magnitude bigger than when idling.
Oil can take some time to refill all the passages, sometimes up to a half a minute or so (you can see that when you have had an engine apart and start it up again it takes some time to get oil pressure) . In that situation you want as little force on the wear surfaces as possible.
Also when things heat up more quickly, it means that some parts heat up more quickly than other parts as it takes time for heat to travel through the metal. That can mean that some things expand more quickly (due to heat) than other things that they wear upon to, changing clearances.
The general advice to drive straight away is that it causes less pollution. A heated up engine is less polluting, and driving straight away means you use the energy otherwise used as idling directly for driving.
There was once a video by engineering explained where the argument of when a car starts cold, it makes the mixture extra rich which can cause droplets of fuel on the cylinder wall infilcting wear and that more quickly heating up the engine will make the mixture lean more quickly.
In a way that is true, but all modern car has a so called open loop and closed loop state. In closed loop the mixture is adjusted to its need, and in that situation the statement of engineering explained is true. However, every car waits for around 50sec-1min for the lambdasensors to warm up to go to that closed loop state (without the lambda sensors working properly, it doesnt work). This is a set time (there is no temperature measuring involved). Until that time, the car runs in open loop. That means it has a non adjusted pre-set mapping that is thus not adjusted by the need of the mixture. The amount of mixture is injected by measurement of the inlet temp sensor/MAF and the throttle position and not adjusted by the lambda sensor (that can measure if all fuel is burned or not), so for that first 50 sec-1min the mixture is rich anyway, regardless of driving or idling. And if that preset mapping is set correctly, you get to the point that there is way less fuel in the cylinder cavety when idling than when driving, which means there is less fuel to condense on the cylinder walls and because less air (and less gas) is let into the cylinder all together (because of the closed throttle body), the vapour point is even more shifted, resulting in even less chance of fuel condensing on the cylinder wall.
That that guy didnt even mention closed or open loop says to me that he overlooked that. Only in closed loop the engine can lean itself out, but that only starts to happen 1 min after its started.

Thats my view on it anyway.
So when really cold, let it idle for about a minute imho.
Also a z4m will take a lot longer to get hot/to get to operating temperature because of the iron block (iron is a bad heat conductor and has more heat capacity, so it needs more energy to heat up and it gets that energy more slowly). This means heat is distributed more slowly through the engine.
 
TomK said:
For me that doesn't sound normal at all. Mine is fine when cold, obviously treating it with a bit of respect. No flat spots or misfiring here.
When was the car last serviced op? Could be the sign of a plug or coil on its way out?

I'm with Tom. My engine is fine from cold, runs normally and no hesitation at all. It is not eager to rev much. I would say the transmission is terrible when cold but soon warms enough to be normal. Your describing a problem with the engine somewhere, something is not correct but it is being hidden. The S54 gets away with so much as people say it ticks, and does this and that, when actually they are avoiding a problem.
 
Steve84N said:
Letting it sit when cold before driving it is actually not the best thing for it as it stays colder for longer. Driving it gently straight away warms everything more quickly and it's when it's cold that more wear occurs.

Only meant a couple of mins buddy
As does damage to car otherwise:)
Just like oil to move around a few times
 
Still get very flat spots at about 2600rpm. It does it long enough, I can put my foot to the floor and the engine just sits at those revs, then picks up slowly (at which point, I ease off the gas). When it's warm, at about 2800rpm the power changes for the better!
 
Doesn't matter how cold it is, car covered in frost and scraping windscreen. When I turn the key the car starts first time and purrs. No, judders, coughs or splutters. I keep it under 2500rpm until it's warmed up. An engine shouldn't start to play up because it's cold. I'd take it to bits, piece by piece and put it back together. If you have any parts left over and it still runs then it's obvious those parts were to blame. :thumbsup: Seriously tho' I'd get it looked at. That's not normal.
 
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