Employment contract advise

M

Mowflow

Senior member
 Glasgow
Long story short. Speaking to a few places about going to work for them at the moment but my 3 month notice period is a bit of a sticking point.

Initially I was only on a 3 week notice but a few years back they reissued our contracts with it upped to 12 weeks and dangled the incentive of profit share bonuses paid once a year. Thing is, the bonuses never came and we were always just fobbed off when questions were asked. Basically they didn't deliver on any of the promises.

I'd need to check but I dare say the contract is worded in such a way that the sneaky bastards have some kind of get out on the bonuses.

So, will I be in breach of contract if I refuse to work the 12 weeks and say I'm offski in 4? If so will they/can they take me to the cleaners?
 
Hey. Bit sh*t they have never paid bonus in the last few years after the change.

Without seeing the contract I would imagine that there is wording in there to the effect of the bonus is non-contractual and is not 'compulsory'.

Are you a contractor? Since you mentioned the contract changed a few years ago, then you must be permanent. In that case, most future employers will understand that you have a period of notice in your current job. In my last job I also had 3 months notice.
 
3 months notice is fairly commonplace isn't it? It's never been an issue on any interview I've been to. In fact they usually say something like "how long is your notice period - 3 months?" which implies it's pretty standard. What industry are you in?

As O&A says, most bonuses are "discretionary" and not part of your T&C's.
 
Bonus schemes are usually tied to performance, either personal or company related to something like sales ot profit.

Notice periods are often negotiable.
 
OG is correct re bonuses, they are all discretionary - if your firm dosen't want to - it dosen't have to pay them.

one of the old ways of dealing with this is to put your notice in (3 months) and when they ask where you are going, say - "im not telling you". If you are in a competitive industry, they will assume you are going to a competitor and ask you you to leave - lots of firms had that as a "HR rule" - I dont know if they still do, but I have used it - and been properly paid up
 
Of course the contract needs to be read related to bonus, but in general forget it. Either it's discretionary if they pay it, or you can't be under notice (or often warning or discipline).

In terms of the notice period in general you can just walk out (if you're an employee). Their only recompense is to not pay for the weeks not worked.

In any event read the contract in detail and seek some advice if you intend to do anything other than just work 3 months and forfeit the bonus.
 
as said, the way they have worded bonus it implies exactly that, if you get it, its a bonus. we had the same at our company, i wanted to add a payment in every month for my drivers as a quality bonus. this was to try and stop so many accidents and incident. but as we are saying you will get it every month, we was not aloud to call it a bonus, and had to be changed to payment. this also means that if a driver has an accident in our vehicle we have to write to him, and he has to agree to be deducted money from that payment. employment law is one of the hardest to follow, its so backwards. as for the notice you can give reasonable amount and can speak to the employer and work out a suitable period. if they say three months as stated in the contract then you can leave but will not be paid for the three months.
 
I'll try to clarify some things here as best I can.

Most people in the company are on 3 weeks notice. Myself and other senior staff were all put onto these longer periods and promised a profit share bonus that would be fully transparent. In other words we would be privy to the books and given a fair share of what was made. There was a promise of it all being drawn up by the bosses solicitor but even that promise never came through. I did get paid a bonus a few years back. I was verbally told what I was getting and was told it would be paid in 2 instalments. When it came to the time for the second instalment my boss denied ever saying that. Writing this I'm actually wondering why i've stayed here so long. I'm now the last person left at the company who was given this promise. I don't know the contracts of more recent staff, nor do I care.

The company is run like a pirate ship. It's a small company owned by a husband and wife (who I think are getting a divorce so not a nice atmosphere). They've never really had an issue with screwing people over and seem incapable of keeping a professional relationship when people decide to leave. It's a competitive industry but I still couldn't see them telling me to leave early. Even I just sat in a room with my arms folded for the duration of my notice they would be happy as it would mean nobody else is benefitting from having me work for them.

Still, it's good to know that the likely outcome would be that they just wouldn't pay me the notice. I could live with that so it's an option should things go that way.
 
Contract of employment are always described as by mutual agreement for changes that would include notice period but as others have always said the decision to leave is yours and it will result in potentially loss of reference or holiday pay etc but nothing can prevent you from leaving whenever you like.

:D
 
Sounds like you're making the right decision to move on. Go get the new job. Agree how soon they'd like you onboard, then go negotiate with your existing employer. Often to agree to work a month and complete some project, handover, etc is all they want. Few want a meager around for 3 months.
That way you'll get a reference if needed, although by law they cannot give a poor reference if you upset them.

If it goes wrong walk out and get paid for just what you have worked.

Sorry but forget bonus - it won't happen.

Within weeks the old company will be forgotten and you'll be way happier.
 
References aren't a concern. It's a small industry up here and myself and the quality of my work is well known in the industry.

I'm not expecting a bonus, I gave up on that many years ago. I was more mentioning the bonus as if things got into the breach of contract territory then did the fact they promised profit share then didn't bother their arses mean that they had breached it already anyway.

All beside the point given the advice i've been given by the trustworthy and ever dependable souls of this forum. Thank you all once again.
 
If you leave before the end of notice you are in breach on contract. In the first instance this means that effectively the contract is terminated and they could hold back any monies due, although you do have some right here to recover monies earnt my advice would be to leave on pay day. Likewise get any expenses etc in as recovery might be hard if you walk out. You may also lose holiday pay or entitlement if you walk out. This does get a little more complicated if there are penalties in your contract for breach. My old contract with Xerox had be that said they could deduct one days pay per week not worked, not sure how legal that was as never had to test it.

However this might get even more complicated if you current employee can show (in court) that you leaving early has cost them. If they are so inclined they could take you to civil court to recoup these costs. But they need to show these cost are really to do with you leaving, for example a big contract lost solely because you left early, having to buy in expensive external consultants, extra training cost that they had to pay that otherwise you could have delivered in notice period. In practice these are hard to prove unless you are in a very specialised roll. Plus they have to have a reasonably good idea that you are worth suing and simply go on a payment plan of £1 a week etc etc.

Also precedent is always useful in employment law, if other people in the company have been allowed to leave without working full notice you might have a case to show that you should be allowed the same. Proving this can be hard though.

My advice talk to new employer and get assurances that if you have to work notice, or are placed on gardening leave and current company won't release that the new one will hold job open. The tell current company you are leaving and make it clear your notice period is up for negotiation. If they don't negotiate then work to rule.
 
your an the employee and are therefore OWNED by the employer, well that's what they think

if you find a good job to go to then personally I would give as much notice as I needed to, a good new employer should understand your current contract and they should allow you to work the notice required
 
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