E86 price trends...

[Zedebee]

I've not paid attention long enough to have a feel for price trends (hence this thread!) although perhaps interestingly, of the 254 manual coupes registered in the UK https://www.howmanyleft.co.uk/vehicle/bmw_z4_3.0si_coupe (inc. 38 SORN), 30 of them are currently for sale on Autotrader... which seems like quite a lot!

The how many left data is wrong.
https://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=135177#:~:text=2189%20Si%20Coupes%20for%20the,M%20Coupes%20%3D%202781%20Z4%20Coupes.

Thanks - wasn't aware of that; sad / bizarre that howmanyleft are so wrong!

It’s not wrong exactly, it’s just that dealers haven’t been consistent with their registrations. Check this link:
https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2036934&hilit=Howmanyleft#p2036934

 

[van man]

Mines £4490 yes up on the miles but a good little car can’t believe it’s not sold but the market is absolutely dead, someone on the Facebook saying he is fed up with people advertising the E86 so cheap as he has a E86 with 109,000 miles on it that is worth £8,500 deluded ….the reality is mine would go at £4k fairly swiftly but I’d rather turn it into a greenhouse

I’ve seen your car on FB; looks like a bargain to be fair.

I think people get carried away with the rarity but they have a limited following as well. They seem quite hard to sell privately; Zachary Luke seems to be shifting cars fairly quickly.

its £4395 now ….

 

[van man]

Mines £4490 yes up on the miles but a good little car can’t believe it’s not sold but the market is absolutely dead, someone on the Facebook saying he is fed up with people advertising the E86 so cheap as he has a E86 with 109,000 miles on it that is worth £8,500 deluded ….the reality is mine would go at £4k fairly swiftly but I’d rather turn it into a greenhouse

I’ve seen your car on FB; looks like a bargain to be fair.

I think people get carried away with the rarity but they have a limited following as well. They seem quite hard to sell privately; Zachary Luke seems to be shifting cars fairly quickly.

its £4395 now ….

 

[Z450]

As said I don’t think the limited following helps.

Also the same old hang up in the Uk with mileage over 100,000 miles does not help with many of these having well over 100,000 miles. This is why I think some of the higher mileage stuff hangs around and is cheap!

The lower mileage stuff still seems to sell from what I can see

 

[TOMGREEN413]

I've been reading this thread with interest and having just sold my E86 (it's listed as SOLD on this forum) I thought I'd share my own experience.
So I listed it on Autotrader and this forum about 5 weeks ago, I tried to be realistic and was hoping for a quick sale, bought it about 18 months ago for 7700 and spent about 2k on preventative maintenance and bringing it up to a nice condition, and in my ownership it drove superbly and never gave me any problems but l was thinking of moving to an F type ( research and issues with injectors stuck in engine blocks has put that dream to bed......Cayman instead now) . Forum price started at 7999 then l dropped to 6900 and absolutely......tumble weed.....apart from just one prive pm from someone about 30 minutes drive away who said they'd give me 6k but couldn't even be bothered to drive over to view it, that offer was politely refused. On Autotrader I had it up for £7500 and again no interest at all (also of note I'd looked to PX it for an F-TYPE and two different dealers offered me £5000/£5500) . As I only use the Coupe for the summer and it would soon be SORN time I'd figured that if she didn't sell I'd keep her as l wasn't prepared to literally give it away and besides the Coupe is such a beautiful car to look at and drive.
Then out of the blue on Sunday afternoon l get a call from Autotrader, a buyer in Coventry..........he came on the Monday.......and bought without haggling on the 7500 price. ( if I'm honest I believe he fell in love with it immediately as even if l do say myself it looks amazing for its age and 105k mileage, besides it had a near faultless mot history and all the usual preventative maintenance bits done) the test drive didn't go too well unfortunately when during the new owners test the plastic Bush inside the Stormworks gear knob crumbled and as he changed gear it came off in his hand......leaving just a the sharft !!!!! Fortunately the Allen key was in the car and an emergency repair was conducted by myself whilst we were still on the move and before we reached any junctions.........NIGHTMARE, but to be honest l had kinda resigned myself to keeping my Coupe so l wasn't that freaked out ....so it seems neither was the potential new owner as one we arrived home he immediately said that he would have it .
I won't lie that my heart was sad to see it drive away with the new owner as these Coupes are such an amazing car and one of the few cars on the roads today that turn your head.........anyway..that's my story,
We still have our amazing e89 that is a joy to own and drive and as of writing l have an empty garage space that may or may not being filled with a
late model post 2011 Cayman or Cayman S.........kinda depends on what our current government plans are re taxes and duties etc and the potential of a blocked straights of Hormuz and energy crisis if full scale war breaks out in the Middle East besides a few domestic issues here in UK. I can see why these Coupes are addictive as l haven't ruled out another in the future but perhaps one that's been a well loved garage queen!!

 

[TOMGREEN413]

I also think the lack of interest is also because these are such a rare car and aren't even on many sports cars buyers radar hence it appears knowone wants them , the Coupe would often be approached by admiring car enthusiasts who would nearly always ask me "never seen one of these before what is it", so I think this is an important thing of note.... rarity and lack of awareness of these car.

 

[Fred Smith]

I also think the lack of interest is also because these are such a rare car and aren't even on many sports cars buyers radar hence it appears knowone wants them , the Coupe would often be approached by admiring car enthusiasts who would nearly always ask me "never seen one of these before what is it", so I think this is an important thing of note.... rarity and lack of awareness of these car.

I 100% agree with this. I have always been interested in cars, a love coupes having had two Capris in the late 90s. But I am not some massive car nut at all, and never paid any attention to new releases. I was aware of Z3s and Z4s but never paid any real attention. I'm not sure I was even aware of the Z4 coupe until a year or so back... and when I became aware / fully conscious of it I'm like "this is amazing, so much cheaper to buy and maintain than a porsche. I love the classic coupe looks. I love the rear wheel drive. I love that it is powerful and fast... and I don't mind that it isn't more powerful or faster, it has all the power I need. I love that it is fairly practical."

In terms of your experience selling... makes perfect sense. I suppose what fascinates me (I am a valuer of property by trade) is "what is the market value of Tom's old car?" Part of me says you marketed it for a month of two and got £7.5k so that's the value. Part of me thinks that you were a bit lucky he turned up after a month or two, and you might not have found the right buyer for another three months. Market value should be able to be achieved reasonably easily, and I think there's an argument that your car's value is / was more like £6k or £6.5k... but because they are rare and unknown sellers with good examples can get lucky and get a bit above value.

I certainly think there is a MASSIVE difference between the price you'd get if you were selling a dirty 100k car with a bit of a noise coming from the engine and the same car if you detailed it and fixed the issues. The people paying top money want decent examples, and if you can't be bothered to maintain or present it well then your market is bargain hunters.

 

[Fred Smith]

ps [tangent]... I once sold a second hand push bike... the bloke took it for a test ride (with me behind on another bike). Because I'd set the gears up badly the rear derailleur went into the spokes, damaged the wheel, ripped the derailleur off and he fell off the bike.... still managed to get it sold to him!!!

 

[TOMGREEN413]

 

[Special Kay]

I also think the lack of interest is also because these are such a rare car and aren't even on many sports cars buyers radar hence it appears knowone wants them , the Coupe would often be approached by admiring car enthusiasts who would nearly always ask me "never seen one of these before what is it", so I think this is an important thing of note.... rarity and lack of awareness of these car.

I agree with your assessment. I also think that most people, that are not car enthusiasts think of the coupe as a Z4M. I've had many people think my car was an M only to be corrected by myself when I say its only a 3.0si.

 

[DaveP]

I also think the lack of interest is also because these are such a rare car and aren't even on many sports cars buyers radar hence it appears knowone wants them , the Coupe would often be approached by admiring car enthusiasts who would nearly always ask me "never seen one of these before what is it", so I think this is an important thing of note.... rarity and lack of awareness of these car.

The other thing that holds them back is that contemporary magazine tests never really raved about them as a "sports car". Evo ran one around the track at Bedford and said it was surprisingly good, but it never got the coverage that something like a Cayman (or any of the numerous drop-top alternatives) did.

This is ultimately the problem keeping Z4 prices down. They are just too competent and conservatively set up from the factory.

If you're at top money for a coupe, then you're into early Cayman or 987 Boxster territory. You'd have to really want a Z4 to not buy a car that handles significantly better and has a much more desirable badge. Add a couple of grand and you're into Z4MR land, which is a huge leap up from a coupe.

At bottom-end money (£5-6k), there are loads of alternatives that have more appeal to the budget-conscious buyer. They'd be looking at 350Zs, because they are hairy, lairy, RWD Jap cars (that I think are actually a bit rubbish). They'd be looking at E46s, TTs, or the numerous hot hatches (Astra VXR, Focus ST etc.) that can monster a Z4 in a straight line with a remap.

The Z4 is a brilliant all-rounder, and the coupe is a fabulous piece of design. It's just a shame (for us all) that values don't reflect that.

 

[STC_Zed]

I also think the lack of interest is also because these are such a rare car and aren't even on many sports cars buyers radar hence it appears knowone wants them , the Coupe would often be approached by admiring car enthusiasts who would nearly always ask me "never seen one of these before what is it", so I think this is an important thing of note.... rarity and lack of awareness of these car.

The other thing that holds them back is that contemporary magazine tests never really raved about them as a "sports car". Evo ran one around the track at Bedford and said it was surprisingly good, but it never got the coverage that something like a Cayman (or any of the numerous drop-top alternatives) did.

This is ultimately the problem keeping Z4 prices down. They are just too competent and conservatively set up from the factory.

If you're at top money for a coupe, then you're into early Cayman or 987 Boxster territory. You'd have to really want a Z4 to not buy a car that handles significantly better and has a much more desirable badge. Add a couple of grand and you're into Z4MR land, which is a huge leap up from a coupe.

At bottom-end money (£5-6k), there are loads of alternatives that have more appeal to the budget-conscious buyer. They'd be looking at 350Zs, because they are hairy, lairy, RWD Jap cars (that I think are actually a bit rubbish). They'd be looking at E46s, TTs, or the numerous hot hatches (Astra VXR, Focus ST etc.) that can monster a Z4 in a straight line with a remap.

The Z4 is a brilliant all-rounder, and the coupe is a fabulous piece of design. It's just a shame (for us all) that values don't reflect that.

As I think I’ve said already, the Cayman / Boxster are usually the default choice despite the potential bork factor. The Boxster can be picked up for comparably little money; they drive better but have not aged anywhere near as well inside or out.

350/70 Z1’s are also quite a hard sell especially those hit with the full band M tax, although decent 350Z prices seem to be on the up for the right buyer.

The Z4M in both coupe and roadster guise arguably got worse press than the standard cars, particularly the ride which many consider to be way too firm. They also have a reputation for being a bit snappy.

 

[Kenich]

350/70 Z1’s are also quite a hard sell especially those hit with the full band M tax, although decent 350Z prices seem to be on the up for the right buyer.

A mate has recently been trying to lend me his 350Z GT to try it out on a weekend. The common crankshaft / camshaft sensors have stopped that so far, though hopefully il get a go soon. I quite like the looks of the 350/370Z, but that interior however is not a good place. Really tacky / naff plastics that really lets it down for me. The V6 sounds lairy, which is great in small doses but I will have to wait to try out and evaluate the drive for myself!

 

[STC_Zed]

350/70 Z1’s are also quite a hard sell especially those hit with the full band M tax, although decent 350Z prices seem to be on the up for the right buyer.

A mate has recently been trying to lend me his 350Z GT to try it out on a weekend. The common crankshaft / camshaft sensors have stopped that so far, though hopefully il get a go soon though. I quite like the looks of the 350/370Z, but that interior however is not a good place. Really tacky / naff plastics that really lets it down for me. The V6 sounds lairy, which is great in small doses but I will have to wait to try out and evaluate the drive for myself!

The interior isn’t too bad on the 370 but it’s particularly bad on the early 350’s is pretty grotty….and the Z4 isn’t a paragon of high quality but it’s better than the Nissan.

For me, the Z4 needs more exhaust noise which I’ll sort on mine in the spring.

 

[DaveP]

350/70 Z1’s are also quite a hard sell especially those hit with the full band M tax, although decent 350Z prices seem to be on the up for the right buyer.

A mate has recently been trying to lend me his 350Z GT to try it out on a weekend. The common crankshaft / camshaft sensors have stopped that so far, though hopefully il get a go soon. I quite like the looks of the 350/370Z, but that interior however is not a good place. Really tacky / naff plastics that really lets it down for me. The V6 sounds lairy, which is great in small doses but I will have to wait to try out and evaluate the drive for myself!

The 350Z, and to a lesser extent 370Z, interior is awful. Most of the switchgear looks like it was lifted out of a 90s minicab.

Where they both excel is a level of playfulness in the stock chassis that the oversprung, underdamped, understeer-prone Z4 could only dream of. And the noise, of course.

BMW design most of their non-M cars to feel 'sporty' to non car people at low speeds, and safe if they get pushed harder.

 

[DaveP]

ore what is it", so I think this is an important thing of note.... rarity and lack of awareness of these car.
The other thing that holds them back is that contemporary magazine tests never really raved about them as a "sports car". Evo ran one around the track at Bedford and said it was surprisingly good, but it never got the coverage that something like a Cayman (or any of the numerous drop-top alternatives) did.

This is ultimately the problem keeping Z4 prices down. They are just too competent and conservatively set up from the factory.

If you're at top money for a coupe, then you're into early Cayman or 987 Boxster territory. You'd have to really want a Z4 to not buy a car that handles significantly better and has a much more desirable badge. Add a couple of grand and you're into Z4MR land, which is a huge leap up from a coupe.

At bottom-end money (£5-6k), there are loads of alternatives that have more appeal to the budget-conscious buyer. They'd be looking at 350Zs, because they are hairy, lairy, RWD Jap cars (that I think are actually a bit rubbish). They'd be looking at E46s, TTs, or the numerous hot hatches (Astra VXR, Focus ST etc.) that can monster a Z4 in a straight line with a remap.

The Z4 is a brilliant all-rounder, and the coupe is a fabulous piece of design. It's just a shame (for us all) that values don't reflect that.
As I think I’ve said already, the Cayman / Boxster are usually the default choice despite the potential bork factor. The Boxster can be picked up for comparably little money; they drive better but have not aged anywhere near as well inside or out.

350/70 Z1’s are also quite a hard sell especially those hit with the full band M tax, although decent 350Z prices seem to be on the up for the right buyer.

The Z4M in both coupe and roadster guise arguably got worse press than the standard cars, particularly the ride which many consider to be way too firm. They also have a reputation for being a bit snappy.

My personal preference/style is much better suited to an M than a non-M Z4. I found the standard handling on the non-Ms to be dreadful, to the point of frustration. That more snappy, tail-happy style is much closer to what a 350/370Z delivers. If BMW hadn't made a horse's arse of the damping out of the factory and made it a bit more compliant to suit UK roads, it would have been a sure-fire winner.

 

[Fred Smith]

The other thing that holds them back is that contemporary magazine tests never really raved about them as a "sports car". Evo ran one around the track at Bedford and said it was surprisingly good, but it never got the coverage that something like a Cayman (or any of the numerous drop-top alternatives) did.

This is ultimately the problem keeping Z4 prices down. They are just too competent and conservatively set up from the factory.

If you're at top money for a coupe, then you're into early Cayman or 987 Boxster territory. You'd have to really want a Z4 to not buy a car that handles significantly better and has a much more desirable badge. Add a couple of grand and you're into Z4MR land, which is a huge leap up from a coupe.

At bottom-end money (£5-6k), there are loads of alternatives that have more appeal to the budget-conscious buyer. They'd be looking at 350Zs, because they are hairy, lairy, RWD Jap cars (that I think are actually a bit rubbish). They'd be looking at E46s, TTs, or the numerous hot hatches (Astra VXR, Focus ST etc.) that can monster a Z4 in a straight line with a remap.

The Z4 is a brilliant all-rounder, and the coupe is a fabulous piece of design. It's just a shame (for us all) that values don't reflect that.

I am not saying you're wrong at all, but my perception is that Porsche are more expensive to own and repair, and are there own unique thing... there are all sorts of cars I've love to own one day, from £2k to £2m, but I've never been particularly attracted to Porsche.

I bought a Z4 coupe because it is a wonderful version of what I see as the classic coupe shape. Porsche have porsche shapes, they fail completely at the classic coupe shape. I like certain car brands more than others, but that is not linked to luxury, price or prestige.

Just because the Z4M is faster doesn't make it better for everyone (even if we ignore cost).

TTs are ugly, E86s look much better than 350Zs and 370Zs, why by a 3 series when you can get a sports car, and I don't want a hot hatch!

But ultimately that is just my highly personal take... and my personal experience is probably reasonably good evidence to help shed light on why they are not more popular. I love the shape of them, absolutely love em... and I am not certain I was even aware they existed until a year or so back when I stumbled upon a video, ended up going down a rabbit hole and coming out the other side saying "I need an E86!".

Part of me thinks a better way of looking at them is an F-type or Vantage looking car for people who are on a budget, or who want their grand tourer to be a more compact sports size, not an overly large cumbersome monster.

 

[DaveP]

The other thing that holds them back is that contemporary magazine tests never really raved about them as a "sports car". Evo ran one around the track at Bedford and said it was surprisingly good, but it never got the coverage that something like a Cayman (or any of the numerous drop-top alternatives) did.

This is ultimately the problem keeping Z4 prices down. They are just too competent and conservatively set up from the factory.

If you're at top money for a coupe, then you're into early Cayman or 987 Boxster territory. You'd have to really want a Z4 to not buy a car that handles significantly better and has a much more desirable badge. Add a couple of grand and you're into Z4MR land, which is a huge leap up from a coupe.

At bottom-end money (£5-6k), there are loads of alternatives that have more appeal to the budget-conscious buyer. They'd be looking at 350Zs, because they are hairy, lairy, RWD Jap cars (that I think are actually a bit rubbish). They'd be looking at E46s, TTs, or the numerous hot hatches (Astra VXR, Focus ST etc.) that can monster a Z4 in a straight line with a remap.

The Z4 is a brilliant all-rounder, and the coupe is a fabulous piece of design. It's just a shame (for us all) that values don't reflect that.

I am not saying you're wrong at all, but my perception is that Porsche are more expensive to own and repair, and are there own unique thing... there are all sorts of cars I've love to own one day, from £2k to £2m, but I've never been particularly attracted to Porsche.

I bought a Z4 coupe because it is a wonderful version of what I see as the classic coupe shape. Porsche have porsche shapes, they fail completely at the classic coupe shape. I like certain car brands more than others, but that is not linked to luxury, price or prestige.

Just because the Z4M is faster doesn't make it better for everyone (even if we ignore cost).

TTs are ugly, E86s look much better than 350Zs and 370Zs, why by a 3 series when you can get a sports car, and I don't want a hot hatch!

But ultimately that is just my highly personal take... and my personal experience is probably reasonably good evidence to help shed light on why they are not more popular. I love the shape of them, absolutely love em... and I am not certain I was even aware they existed until a year or so back when I stumbled upon a video, ended up going down a rabbit hole and coming out the other side saying "I need an E86!".

Part of me thinks a better way of looking at them is an F-type or Vantage looking car for people who are on a budget, or who want their grand tourer to be a more compact sports size, not an overly large cumbersome monster.

I don't think it's a remotely controversial take to say that Porsches cost more to repair. It's pretty much a known fact. I love the idea that my Z4 is built from bits of repmobile, because when it goes wrong I can be confident that Euros will have the part I need for £30.

On the second part, you're missing a bit of context there. People on a budget tend not to set out to buy "a sports car". They have a fixed amount they want to spend, and they'll be trying to maximise their fun per £. My point is simply that there's more fun per £ to be had elsewhere, which is why there's not a queue of people trying to buy every Z4.

On the last bit, you might be onto something but it feels like a bit of a reach. You're spending a fraction of the cost on a Z4 (vs a Vantage or F-Type) and you're getting a fraction of the experience too. Size-wise they really aren't that different, but both of the more expensive cars are heavier and better suited to that proper "GT" stuff like crossing continents in a day. Both are also far better resolved cars out of the factory than the standard Z4.

 

[Fred Smith]

On the last bit, you might be onto something but it feels like a bit of a reach. You're spending a fraction of the cost on a Z4 (vs a Vantage or F-Type) and you're getting a fraction of the experience too. Size-wise they really aren't that different, but both of the more expensive cars are heavier and better suited to that proper "GT" stuff like crossing continents in a day. Both are also far better resolved cars out of the factory than the standard Z4.

A foot longer and 10 cm wider is plenty (Vantage), not least when the Z4 E85 / E86 is a bit bigger and heavier than it should be.

If you wanted a proper GT and money no object you ain't going for Z4. Similarly if you want a proper sports car you're probably not going for a Z4.

But if you like GT looks, but want something that is a bit more sports car a bit less GT, then the Z4 coupe is spot on.. especially if you're on a budget.

As far as I am concerned car should be practical or fun (or some combination)... like push bikes, it is a scientific fact that with cars smaller is more fun!

 

[DaveP]

On the last bit, you might be onto something but it feels like a bit of a reach. You're spending a fraction of the cost on a Z4 (vs a Vantage or F-Type) and you're getting a fraction of the experience too. Size-wise they really aren't that different, but both of the more expensive cars are heavier and better suited to that proper "GT" stuff like crossing continents in a day. Both are also far better resolved cars out of the factory than the standard Z4.

A foot longer and 10 cm wider is plenty (Vantage), not least when the Z4 E85 / E86 is a bit bigger and heavier than it should be.

If you wanted a proper GT and money no object you ain't going for Z4. Similarly if you want a proper sports car you're probably not going for a Z4.

But if you like GT looks, but want something that is a bit more sports car a bit less GT, then the Z4 coupe is spot on.. especially if you're on a budget.

As far as I am concerned car should be practical or fun (or some combination)... like push bikes, it is a scientific fact that with cars smaller is more fun!

I think you've nailed it. The Z4 is basically a 3-series cosplaying as a sportscar/GT.