Diagnostics question re: soft top

[moodhead]

I have the roof opening / closing problem and this morning took the car to an independent bmw specialist. He hooked the car up to the diagnostics but said that he didn't have the right system / software to get any diagnostic readings for the roof system and suggested that I need to go to the stealer. Does anybody know if it is possible for the stealer to identify the problem, i.e motor, hydraulics, micro switch etc without having to dismantle the roof? If it's possible I can at least know what I am in for and then either just live with it or pay a reasonable amount to get it fixed. I have an out of warranty 03 3.0. I bought it from a indie dealer about six months ago and he says that his 1 year warranty only covers engine + transmission so I may have to cover the cost.

If anybody knows if it's possible to isolate / diagnose the problem without removing the whole soft top it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Edit: side note - while I was in the garage there was a silver Z4 there with some kind of twin exhaust system (two pipes either side), it seemed to have been lowered and had massive Hamann wheels. I couldn't get a good look at the car but the alloys must have been 19 or 20 maybe. Anyway I have to say the car looked awesome. The combination of the lowering and massive wheels really transformed the car

 

[*AL*]

What is the roof problem? What is it doing or not doing? More details.

 

[moodhead]

Basically I had a ton of rain a while back, literally about two or three days of non stop rain (I don't have a garage). After it had subsided and a few days later I had a puncture. I took the car to the tyre place, they jacked it up, repaired the puncture and I was on my way. An hour or so later I had to pop out for something, the sun was out, I opened the roof, all worked perfectly. When I was parking up at my destination I went to close the roof and it was really slow coming back up. It slowly came up about half way and then stopped. I tried closing it again and nothing, I tried continuing with the opening and nothing. In the end I slowly pulled the roof up to the pillar and then I was able to lock the roof using the usual button. After that I tried opening it and the following happens. I press the button, the light goes red, it unlatches as usual and then just sits there. Once I kept the button pressed for a while and it opened really slowly. When I tried to close it again it was like it didn't have enough power to lift it. I've checked the stowage thing in the back, it's all ok. I don't know whether it was the rain or being jacked up for the tyre repair or just pure coincidence. Any ideas?

 

[chester]

Aw man that really sucks!!

Are you still in warrenty? It sounds like the rain and gotton into your roof motor and it's buggered it ... I do feel for you as I have the same worry as I also dont have a garage.

Should be a fairly straightforward repair if you take it to BMW, although if you aint covered by warrenty I'd imagine it's goign to be fairly pricey

 

[moodhead]

Aw man that really sucks!!

Are you still in warrenty? It sounds like the rain and gotton into your roof motor and it's buggered it ... I do feel for you as I have the same worry as I also dont have a garage.

Should be a fairly straightforward repair if you take it to BMW, although if you aint covered by warrenty I'd imagine it's goign to be fairly pricey

Yeah, tell me about it! I've only had the car 6 months! Unfortunately no BMW warranty so I'll have to pay for it, that's why I want to see if it's possible to find out the problem and get a quote without them having to remove the roof as the labour charges just for diagnosis will be a killer I reckon. If it is a massive cost I might just leave it for the time being as it's now winter and I can operate it manually on the odd day

In your case I'd suggest getting a car cover, I have one but like an idiot I didn't use it on the three days it rained heavily as I didn't want the roof to go mouldy, if I knew then what I know now I would have covered it even if the roof was soaked.

 

[*AL*]

Sounds like water may have entered the roof motor on the LHS of the car, if it did then it's not good news .Electric motors and water don't go well together unfortunately. Did your roof used to operate quite fast before? I think mine drops in around 6 secs and the motor sounds healthy, going up is quite fast also. Are you sure your frame pivoting points are not seizing? Maybe pulling the roof into position didn't help? Have you checked you roof drain tubes recently to make sure they are not blocked/restricted? Water running off the roof drains into a collecter tray which has a single drain tube each side of the car, if it blocks then it can fill and surround the motor with water............a very poor design imo.

 

[*AL*]

Just to add, what side was your puncture? As the motor is in the left hand side of the car, if the drain tube on that side was blocked then water may have been close to the motor.If the right hand side of the car was jacked up then the water in the left may have swamped the motor so when you used the roof the water logged motor shorted. Just a thought.

 

[Tommo]

Could you take out a warranty direct warranty, leave it a month then make a claim on that?

 

[moodhead]

Just to add, what side was your puncture? As the motor is in the left hand side of the car, if the drain tube on that side was blocked then water may have been close to the motor.If the right hand side of the car was jacked up then the water in the left may have swamped the motor so when you used the roof the water logged motor shorted. Just a thought.

You're probably right, the puncture was on the rear left wheel, I wish I hadn't opened the roof that day and I probably would have been ok. In terms of opening / closing speed it was operating reasonably fast, sometimes it would seem a little reluctant but never anything serious from what I can remember

 

[moodhead]

Could you take out a warranty direct warranty, leave it a month then make a claim on that?

Not a bad idea, not sure if these extended warranties are available in Spain. I'll look into it and if it is a reasonable cost it might be worth having as a safeguard against any future problems. Is it possible to buy an extended warranty from BMW if the car is an 03?

 

[paddy wright]

the silver z sounds like an M- have a search there is a thread on how to clean out the motor as a diy on here somewhere.

 

[Shipkiller]

Mine failed almost like that. It started to get slow then just stopped...

My wife was as the BMW dealers today. They quoted $370.00 for the motor and $500 to replace it....

Since it been over six years since my car has been manufactured, not a bad lifespan... but still sucks....

 

[moodhead]

the silver z sounds like an M- have a search there is a thread on how to clean out the motor as a diy on here somewhere.

It could have been an M, whatever it was it just looked extra wide and 'chunky'. It looked gooooood

I've seen the drain clearing DIY on here but to be honest it's not the sort of thing I would attempt. I'm your add oil, add water, check levels and drive sort of guy. I couldn't trust myself to take the car apart as I'm not sure it would end up the same as it started!

 

[moodhead]

Mine failed almost like that. It started to get slow then just stopped...

My wife was as the BMW dealers today. They quoted $370.00 for the motor and $500 to replace it....

Since it been over six years since my car has been manufactured, not a bad lifespan... but still sucks....

That's helpful thanks, I could just about live with that kind of cost, personally I think BMW should stand by their product even out of warranty when they acknowledge a design fault. It's a 2 seater open top roadster, the top is an integral part and if that doesn't work as it should due to poor design then that sucks :x

 

[daveysew]

"My wife was as the BMW dealers today. They quoted $370.00 for the motor and $500 to replace it...."

Man if the roof on my 2005 fails (like the roof on my 2003 did) out of warranty I'm driving to your dealer for the repair, mine told me it would be a few thousand, due to the labour involved.

 

[Shipkiller]

I may attempt it myself. Not sure yet. I have the TIS procedures but it IS a job to do. The whole top must come out of the car since the motor/hydraulic unit is integral to the top. It comes out as one complete unit. At least that's what I see in the procedures. BMW has this lifting harness that pulls the top up and out at as a unit.

What I see in the procedures, is you have to remove the plastic trim behind the seats to get to the mounts and electrical harness.

 

[*AL*]

the silver z sounds like an M- have a search there is a thread on how to clean out the motor as a diy on here somewhere.

It could have been an M, whatever it was it just looked extra wide and 'chunky'. It looked gooooood

I've seen the drain clearing DIY on here but to be honest it's not the sort of thing I would attempt. I'm your add oil, add water, check levels and drive sort of guy. I couldn't trust myself to take the car apart as I'm not sure it would end up the same as it started!

Believe me it's not very hard to do, just follow the instructions.

 

[moodhead]

Hey Al, thanks for the encouragement, is it possible to push a thin cable or something into the drain so that you can literally push any crap out the bottom? That I reckon I could handle

 

[*AL*]

On the RHS use a torch and look down into the gap and you will see the drain hole.On the LHS you can't see it because the electric motor is in the way. Jack the car up, take the wheel off as it's easier to take off the inner lining.Just a couple of 8mm nuts and a 10mm nut, basically take off the 'flap' then you will see the end of the drain valve.You can poke something up the drain tube to clear it.If your drainage is clear you will be able to gently tip water into the drainage area from the top and see it drip out underneath.

 

[moodhead]

Thanks Al, appreciate the help