A different roof problem

[enuff_zed]

Morning all,

Been at least 5 minutes since someone posted a roof issue so here's mine.
Got me stumped!

Occasionally when I press the roof down button on my 2.2i I get nothing at all. No unlock, no red light, no window drop, no noises from anywhere.
This only happens when the engine is running, and when I am parked up.
If I turn the engine off everything works perfectly every time.
It also works every time by the key in the lock and hold method.

So to me this points to the car thinking it is moving too fast (even though it is stationary)
Anyone ever come across this before?

 

[Smartbear]

Morning all,

Been at least 5 minutes since someone posted a roof issue so here's mine.
Got me stumped!

Occasionally when I press the roof down button on my 2.2i I get nothing at all. No unlock, no red light, no window drop, no noises from anywhere.
This only happens when the engine is running, and when I am parked up.
If I turn the engine off everything works perfectly every time.
It also works every time by the key in the lock and hold method.

So to me this points to the car thinking it is moving too fast (even though it is stationary)
Anyone ever come across this before?

Either that or the roof control has been turned off by terminal 30 :?
Rob

 

[bigwinn]

Whats terminal 30 Rob? Sorry to hijack just interested...

And I couldn't resist: https://youtu.be/Kw-Fl_xGpyY

 

[enuff_zed]

Morning all,

Been at least 5 minutes since someone posted a roof issue so here's mine.
Got me stumped!

Occasionally when I press the roof down button on my 2.2i I get nothing at all. No unlock, no red light, no window drop, no noises from anywhere.
This only happens when the engine is running, and when I am parked up.
If I turn the engine off everything works perfectly every time.
It also works every time by the key in the lock and hold method.

So to me this points to the car thinking it is moving too fast (even though it is stationary)
Anyone ever come across this before?

Either that or the roof control has been turned off by terminal 30 :?
Rob

It works fine 90% of the time though?

 

[Smartbear]

Whats terminal 30 Rob? Sorry to hijack just interested...

And I couldn't resist: https://youtu.be/Kw-Fl_xGpyY

It’s a relay on the fuse panel which turns off different circuits individually as the car slowly goes to sleep, it’s been know to cause problems.
Rob

 

[bigwinn]

Whats terminal 30 Rob? Sorry to hijack just interested...

And I couldn't resist: https://youtu.be/Kw-Fl_xGpyY

It’s a relay on the fuse panel which turns off different circuits individually as the car slowly goes to sleep, it’s been know to cause problems.
Rob

related to gm5?

every day is a school day eh

 

[Smartbear]

Whats terminal 30 Rob? Sorry to hijack just interested...

And I couldn't resist: https://youtu.be/Kw-Fl_xGpyY

This one
Rob

 

[Smartbear]

Morning all,

Been at least 5 minutes since someone posted a roof issue so here's mine.
Got me stumped!

Occasionally when I press the roof down button on my 2.2i I get nothing at all. No unlock, no red light, no window drop, no noises from anywhere.
This only happens when the engine is running, and when I am parked up.
If I turn the engine off everything works perfectly every time.
It also works every time by the key in the lock and hold method.

So to me this points to the car thinking it is moving too fast (even though it is stationary)
Anyone ever come across this before?

Either that or the roof control has been turned off by terminal 30 :?
Rob

It works fine 90% of the time though?

It’s a latch relay with more than one pick up coil, it can get hr contacts
Rob

 

[enuff_zed]

Rob, is really as simple as it looks?
(Like me :roll: )

 

[Smartbear]

Rob, is really as simple as it looks?
(Like me :roll: )

It’s best if you disconnect the battery first before changing the terminal 30 relay as not doing so can isolate some circuits (like the vanos for instance) due to the nature of the latching relay.
Don’t ask me how i know this
Rob

 

[enuff_zed]

Rob, is really as simple as it looks?
(Like me :roll: )

It’s best if you disconnect the battery first before changing the terminal 30 relay as not doing so can isolate some circuits (like the vanos for instance) due to the nature of the latching relay.
Don’t ask me how i know this
Rob

Thanks Rob,
Think I'll be giving that a go then.

Is that the back of the fuse box? Do you need to lower it to get at it?

 

[enuff_zed]

[ref]Smartbear[/ref], you are aware this issue is my E85?
Just wondering as I can only find reference to this on Realoem being on an E89?

Edit: Scratch that! Just looked at the wiring diagram you posted again. Sorry.

 

[Number5]

[ref]Smartbear[/ref], you are aware this issue is my E85?

I agree. It doesnt look like an E85 Fusebox

 

[Smartbear]

[ref]Smartbear[/ref], you are aware this issue is my E85?
Just wondering as I can only find reference to this on Realoem being on an E89?

Edit: Scratch that! Just looked at the wiring diagram you posted again. Sorry.

The pic’s my e89 fuse bay but i believe the e85 has a similar set up with this relay
Rob

 

[enuff_zed]

[ref]Smartbear[/ref], you are aware this issue is my E85?

I agree. It doesnt look like an E85 Fusebox

Would you happen to know where it sits on an E85 fusebox then please?

 

[enuff_zed]

Hi all,

On Rob's advice I have purchased what I hope is the correct Terminal 30 Relay.
I'll swap this out first and see if it fixes it. Being an intermittent issue I may have to wait a while.
Currently convinced it's not a wiring issue as the correlation between engine running/not running is exactly the same every time.

Big question.
Anyone know exactly where this relay is fitted?

[ref]Number5[/ref], the fact you're very quiet is worrying me. :wink:

EDIT:
If it helps anyone to help me, I should also say that when the roof won't work with the engine running I turn it off and it works.
Thereafter it will work fine with the engine running. Almost like a contact is sticking.

 

[Number5]

Yes. I’m quiet as Rob has confused me with his E89 relay board, or maybe I’m reading the situation wrong

Generally I’d first swap out the roof ECU (c£40 on eBay if you can’t borrow one off someone local to try first) as that is a simple task to swap and requires no programming.

Secondly, I’d suspect the sensor loom could be giving you an intermittent fault.

Thirdly, as it’s the most complicated swap, is to look at the GM5 unit. Maybe it’s a signal issue, either speed or voltage related.

However, it’s not a fault I’ve come across myself.

When it refuses to move/work, do you get any LEDs on the roof switches ?

 

[enuff_zed]

Yes. I’m quiet as Rob has confused me with his E89 relay board, or maybe I’m reading the situation wrong

Generally I’d first swap out the roof ECU (c£40 on eBay if you can’t borrow one off someone local to try first) as that is a simple task to swap and requires no programming.

Secondly, I’d suspect the sensor loom could be giving you an intermittent fault.

Thirdly, as it’s the most complicated swap, is to look at the GM5 unit. Maybe it’s a signal issue, either speed or voltage related.

However, it’s not a fault I’ve come across myself.

When it refuses to move/work, do you get any LEDs on the roof switches ?

Cheers Alan,
The relay may have been a red herring it seems? I'll have a good search at the weekend.
Then it'll be ECU.
Sensor loom? Can't rule it out, but this issue of it only failing wit the engine running, then working fine as soon as you turn it off doesn't seem to tally with that?
When it won't work I get nothing, like I'm pressing a button not connected to anything?
I too am at a loss so far.
If I can't locate the relay I'll send Rob the bill and look for an ecu. :roll:

 

[Smartbear]

Yes. I’m quiet as Rob has confused me with his E89 relay board, or maybe I’m reading the situation wrong

Generally I’d first swap out the roof ECU (c£40 on eBay if you can’t borrow one off someone local to try first) as that is a simple task to swap and requires no programming.

Secondly, I’d suspect the sensor loom could be giving you an intermittent fault.

Thirdly, as it’s the most complicated swap, is to look at the GM5 unit. Maybe it’s a signal issue, either speed or voltage related.

However, it’s not a fault I’ve come across myself.

When it refuses to move/work, do you get any LEDs on the roof switches ?

Cheers Alan,
The relay may have been a red herring it seems? I'll have a good search at the weekend.
Then it'll be ECU.
Sensor loom? Can't rule it out, but this issue of it only failing wit the engine running, then working fine as soon as you turn it off doesn't seem to tally with that?
When it won't work I get nothing, like I'm pressing a button not connected to anything?
I too am at a loss so far.
If I can't locate the relay I'll send Rob the bill and look for an ecu. :roll:

No guarantees with Smartbear diagnostic advice but your issue does sound different from most e85 roof faults & i know this relay could potentially be the cause, pics were of my car but the e85 uses similar technology so worth trying as they’re not that expensive.
If it doesn’t work send it to my receptionist @ Smartbear Towers
Rob

 

[enuff_zed]

Yes. I’m quiet as Rob has confused me with his E89 relay board, or maybe I’m reading the situation wrong

Generally I’d first swap out the roof ECU (c£40 on eBay if you can’t borrow one off someone local to try first) as that is a simple task to swap and requires no programming.

Secondly, I’d suspect the sensor loom could be giving you an intermittent fault.

Thirdly, as it’s the most complicated swap, is to look at the GM5 unit. Maybe it’s a signal issue, either speed or voltage related.

However, it’s not a fault I’ve come across myself.

When it refuses to move/work, do you get any LEDs on the roof switches ?

Cheers Alan,
The relay may have been a red herring it seems? I'll have a good search at the weekend.
Then it'll be ECU.
Sensor loom? Can't rule it out, but this issue of it only failing wit the engine running, then working fine as soon as you turn it off doesn't seem to tally with that?
When it won't work I get nothing, like I'm pressing a button not connected to anything?
I too am at a loss so far.
If I can't locate the relay I'll send Rob the bill and look for an ecu. :roll:

No guarantees with Smartbear diagnostic advice but your issue does sound different from most e85 roof faults & i know this relay could potentially be the cause, pics were of my car but the e85 uses similar technology so worth trying as they’re not that expensive.
If it doesn’t work send it to my receptionist @ Smartbear Towers
Rob

Hi Rob,
The issue is I can't find it!
According to realoem there are two lilac roof relays behind the glove box.
The only other possible option I can see is the blue DME relay in the engine bay, but I'm loath to mess with that on a whim.