5.0 litre v8 e85 z4
- Thread starter bradmarsh1989
- Start date
Ye true but its all these EU regs getting stricter every year, there will be no NA engines at all in the next 5 years. Probably one of the best engines BMW have made same weight as the S54 with 75hp more, not much bigger either so it could be a really good replacement for an S54. plenty of M3s at breakers.
Jonny why not keep your four pot that you know is in good order. Have a turbo or SC done properly to that?
Get some lumpy cams head work a few other bits n bobs ( blow that 5k budget you could have something quite unique )
Jonny essex said:Ok just found a company that can re-map my Zed, and with the rpi air scoop and quad exhaust due soon and a fresh serviced engine i dont see why i cant squeeze out another 25-30bhp so more power then a 2.2 and most 2.5
This is gone from ridiculous to darn right comical....
remap on an NA is unlikely to give you anymore power, let alone 25bhp - which on a 150 bhp stock is over 15%!!
the only real benefit of a remap would be a smother power curve/ delivery.
If you want more power and keep your car get a supercharger.. simples.
True you need some force induction to get anything noticeable. If you went with the racy cams and all that. You probably wouldn't enjoy driving it round town.
Liverpool
You mean he wouldn't be buying a brand new one from BMWthe cueball said:ehhh...full, working MOT'd and Taxed M V10 cars are going for 12K.
M V8 ones for much less...
"normal" V8's for even less...
Where do you make up your figures from???
£20k was a typo, as you can see my total for the whole job in the line below was £20k, and I know you can pick up some leggy engines with dodgy provenance for as little as £3k
Doesn't the 'sprint booster' simply change the activation map of the throttle like sport mode does. Didn't think it added any more power though!Jonny essex said:Ok just found a company that can re-map my Zed, and with the rpi air scoop, sprint booster chip, quad exhaust due soon and a fresh serviced engine i dont see why i cant squeeze out another 25-30bhp so more power then a 2.2 and most 2.5
them fighting words.... nice...
On my 2.2i I had 15hp extra with a remap (proven by dyno test), so now 185hp instead of 170hp. Also much better throttle response, and especially the latter is very noticeable. The gains in power, not so much. But my next step is removing the mid muffler (already have an aftermarket free-flow backbox) and sportcats (200 cells), which might give me again about 15 or 20 hp extra. I'll be going from 170hp up to 200hp for about 1.500 euro in total. i think that is very acceptable.
I recently saw a supercharger set for the M54 engine (E46 model in this case) for 3.000 euro including remap to get it working properly and would give you up to a 50% hp increase. That would bring my car up to 300hp at that point, without yet having changed the exhaust manifold and camshaft...
So surely there are enough options out there to get more power out of your engine. However, how far do you want to go and how will it affect your engine in the long run? I wouls like to go up to 200hp maybe even 250hp, but anything more than that for a 2.2i would become dangerous I reckon...
I recently saw a supercharger set for the M54 engine (E46 model in this case) for 3.000 euro including remap to get it working properly and would give you up to a 50% hp increase. That would bring my car up to 300hp at that point, without yet having changed the exhaust manifold and camshaft...
So surely there are enough options out there to get more power out of your engine. However, how far do you want to go and how will it affect your engine in the long run? I wouls like to go up to 200hp maybe even 250hp, but anything more than that for a 2.2i would become dangerous I reckon...
Jonny essex said:
I dyno'd my car soon after i got it, under 8k miles and it was something like 256bhp, vs 261bhp. I swear if the wind changed direction my dyno would have said 261bhp... But anyhow...
My previous s2k i changed the high cams and the header, got a power fc and to play with my maps and got an extra 15bhp. Total cost around £2k.
K&N airfilters are not more effective then paper airfilters... And a ram air with a cone will probably decrease power with the heat soak.
I'd love to see you prove me wrong with your car (and BMW with their millions on R&D) but i learnt the hard way... Remapping an NA is futile without hard cash thrown in on hardware.
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pokeybritches
Member
You're misinformed if you think you'll get 25 bhp from a "chip" (which is incorrect in its own right, as cars are now reflashed rather than having a chip soldered in). 5 horsepower is possible. 25 is not. Take it from someone who has fully investigated the limits of the M54. A supercharger is the best bang for the buck, though I'm not sure if they make them for your car. You will need an astronomical budget to surpass 100 hp/liter naturally aspirated in the M54, and even then the engine life will be measured in HOURS.
Horsepower = torque x rpm / 5252. You can only get a certain amount of torque out of an engine of a specific displacement without forced induction, no matter what you do to it. Torque usually falls off as the engine moves faster and becomes less efficient. You can do things to make it more efficient in the upper rpm, like install cams with different profiles (at the expense of torque at low rpm and driveability)... or install a less restrictive exhaust system. Cams, exhaust, and tune will net you a good 20-30 hp at the top end, maybe a little more. At the end of the day, a supercharger which maintains all your OEM functions is the best compromise if you want serious power. If you're set on a swap, go with the S54. They are much more common, cheaper, and easier to wire in. I know of a guy (Mike Essa) with a 2.5i that swapped in a S54 turbo, making over 600 rwhp. The tuning wasn't done on the OEM DME, so you probably wouldn't be interested in going that route.
Dynos are easily manipulated. Horsepower varies as much as 5-20 hp per run, depending on how hot the car gets. By taking a weak "before" dyno and comparing it with the best "after" dyno, you can deceptively imply larger-than-life gains. If you want a true before/after, you will need the dyno done through a third party with no association with a tuner. Then, honestly take the best of both the before and after runs to show gains. Jumping to a conclusion prior to an unbiased investigation opens data up for manipulation, due to the temptation to prove something. If a tuner tells you something is possible, and you bite off on it, he’s going to feel pressured to realize unrealistic dreams. I’m not saying he’s dishonest… perhaps misinformed… however, I am keenly aware of human nature, and a business needs to prove its worth to remain relevant (and take your money).
I’d love a V8 or V10 swap in my Z. The main reason tuners do them, however, is to show off their capabilities. They do it because they can. The rest of us ohh and ahh over it When my engine goes, I’ll swap in another identical engine… though I have thought about a low compression build.
Horsepower = torque x rpm / 5252. You can only get a certain amount of torque out of an engine of a specific displacement without forced induction, no matter what you do to it. Torque usually falls off as the engine moves faster and becomes less efficient. You can do things to make it more efficient in the upper rpm, like install cams with different profiles (at the expense of torque at low rpm and driveability)... or install a less restrictive exhaust system. Cams, exhaust, and tune will net you a good 20-30 hp at the top end, maybe a little more. At the end of the day, a supercharger which maintains all your OEM functions is the best compromise if you want serious power. If you're set on a swap, go with the S54. They are much more common, cheaper, and easier to wire in. I know of a guy (Mike Essa) with a 2.5i that swapped in a S54 turbo, making over 600 rwhp. The tuning wasn't done on the OEM DME, so you probably wouldn't be interested in going that route.
Dynos are easily manipulated. Horsepower varies as much as 5-20 hp per run, depending on how hot the car gets. By taking a weak "before" dyno and comparing it with the best "after" dyno, you can deceptively imply larger-than-life gains. If you want a true before/after, you will need the dyno done through a third party with no association with a tuner. Then, honestly take the best of both the before and after runs to show gains. Jumping to a conclusion prior to an unbiased investigation opens data up for manipulation, due to the temptation to prove something. If a tuner tells you something is possible, and you bite off on it, he’s going to feel pressured to realize unrealistic dreams. I’m not saying he’s dishonest… perhaps misinformed… however, I am keenly aware of human nature, and a business needs to prove its worth to remain relevant (and take your money).
I’d love a V8 or V10 swap in my Z. The main reason tuners do them, however, is to show off their capabilities. They do it because they can. The rest of us ohh and ahh over it
When my engine goes, I’ll swap in another identical engine… though I have thought about a low compression build.You'll get 15hp extra on reflash, including a K&N. And mounting a supercharger / turbu surely is possible.
But I'm afraid for the rest they are right Johnny, there's not much possible with a 2L engine, we have to be realistic here...
I more than understand your lust for power, but trading in the Zed or buying a second one and swap what you want to keep, is really your best bet...
A friend of mine just swapped hiz 2L for an E89 2L, which already had the turbo. It has 165hp standard, but with a reflash will go up to 204hp... But he had to pay an extra 20.000 euro on top of his E85 to get it (new car that is).
I've had a 3L before this one (Porsche) and it's a BIG difference. You should really consider the 3.0i and have that one reflashed for optimal power...
But I'm afraid for the rest they are right Johnny, there's not much possible with a 2L engine, we have to be realistic here...
I more than understand your lust for power, but trading in the Zed or buying a second one and swap what you want to keep, is really your best bet...
A friend of mine just swapped hiz 2L for an E89 2L, which already had the turbo. It has 165hp standard, but with a reflash will go up to 204hp... But he had to pay an extra 20.000 euro on top of his E85 to get it (new car that is).
I've had a 3L before this one (Porsche) and it's a BIG difference. You should really consider the 3.0i and have that one reflashed for optimal power...
pokeybritches said:You're misinformed if you think you'll get 25 bhp from a "chip" (which is incorrect in its own right, as cars are now reflashed rather than having a chip soldered in). 5 horsepower is possible. 25 is not. Take it from someone who has fully investigated the limits of the M54. A supercharger is the best bang for the buck, though I'm not sure if they make them for your car. You will need an astronomical budget to surpass 100 hp/liter naturally aspirated in the M54, and even then the engine life will be measured in HOURS.
Horsepower = torque x rpm / 5252. You can only get a certain amount of torque out of an engine of a specific displacement without forced induction, no matter what you do to it. Torque usually falls off as the engine moves faster and becomes less efficient. You can do things to make it more efficient in the upper rpm, like install cams with different profiles (at the expense of torque at low rpm and driveability)... or install a less restrictive exhaust system. Cams, exhaust, and tune will net you a good 20-30 hp at the top end, maybe a little more. At the end of the day, a supercharger which maintains all your OEM functions is the best compromise if you want serious power. If you're set on a swap, go with the S54. They are much more common, cheaper, and easier to wire in. I know of a guy (Mike Essa) with a 2.5i that swapped in a S54 turbo, making over 600 rwhp. The tuning wasn't done on the OEM DME, so you probably wouldn't be interested in going that route.
Dynos are easily manipulated. Horsepower varies as much as 5-20 hp per run, depending on how hot the car gets. By taking a weak "before" dyno and comparing it with the best "after" dyno, you can deceptively imply larger-than-life gains. If you want a true before/after, you will need the dyno done through a third party with no association with a tuner. Then, honestly take the best of both the before and after runs to show gains. Jumping to a conclusion prior to an unbiased investigation opens data up for manipulation, due to the temptation to prove something. If a tuner tells you something is possible, and you bite off on it, he’s going to feel pressured to realize unrealistic dreams. I’m not saying he’s dishonest… perhaps misinformed… however, I am keenly aware of human nature, and a business needs to prove its worth to remain relevant (and take your money).
I’d love a V8 or V10 swap in my Z. The main reason tuners do them, however, is to show off their capabilities. They do it because they can. The rest of us ohh and ahh over it
What this man said. If 25bhp was do-able from a remap and filter, every enthusiast would do it. But we've seen time and time again on here that it doesn't work (anyone remember Ricey's review? :lol: )
The BMW airflow is pretty efficient as it is. Remapping the electrics can fine tune air intake, ignition timing and fuel mixture etc, but there's no way to squeeze 20bhp+ from naturally aspirated 2 litre unless you start upgrading internals, cams etc.
If it does turn out to add 50bhp (or even 25bhp, as once you factor in 2 extra cylinders, that'll make 37.5bhp) - I'll be the first to go out and get my car a K&N and a remap
Ps Johnny - did you really buy your car from new? I couldn't tell from the number of times you've mentioned it
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