3.0 Z4 (231bhp) vs. hot hatches

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tyranical

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How do they compare? Around corners i'd think the Z4 the edge but some of these modern hot hatches, astra and corsa VXR's, new leon cupra's etc. I'd think the Z4 will struggle in a straight line?

Just asking as I'm intending to get a 3.0 in april and I enjoy some nice spirited driving through Wales with my friends during the summer months, would hate to buy something that looks sporty but gets shown up by these turbocharged hot hatches.

Cheers,

Matt
 
Sadly your gonna have to live with this one some of these hot hatches are quick but personally they are that hot hatches the Z4 is a classy two seater much better looking
 
A Corsa VXR won't get near. It handles surprisingly well (Lotus engineered handling), but it's still 160bhp from an awful engine. But must say a Focus RS (300bhp), Megane 250 (250bhp), and some of the fastest VAG hot hatches will certainly give you a run for the money.

Of course none of them are convertible, or have an amazing 6 cylinder naturally aspirated engine. They use turbos to cheat, and have the associated lag (albeit not that bad). On the road it's all largely nullified though, you are all limited by the speed limits so the only differentiation is handling and acceleration. I'll tell you one thing, no hot hatch is anywhere near as exciting as my Z4 2.0 (and that's slooowwww). I know this because I test drove many. I expected the Astra VXR to be a right handful after all the reviews - it's totally inert. A small bit of torque steer at the most, it's just not involving at all. Z4 feels a lot faster than it actually is, so while you may not be going any faster, you'll certainly feel you are.

You've got to remember that hot hatches are currently in horsepower wars. They're all trying to stuff as much horsepower in as possible, because that's what the target market wants. They want to go as fast as possible in a straight line. They're the European version of the muscle car, just without the nice engines. The end result is a car that doesn't sound that great (a big tuned exhaust does not a nice sound make), doesn't really feel that great to drive, but goes like stink.
 
Most hot hatches in the hands of Mr average are also exceedingly quick through corners being FWD and very compliant. For this reason even a decent turbo diesel hatch can give you a hard time through a series of S bends.

Keeps the tyres planted then a truckload of torque to get out of the corner.

RWD and balance 50:50 should be fastest in a good drivers hands

Very different animals though...
 
Bad news, I had a Leon FR TD170 which had the same 230 ft lbs torque as a 3.0 Zed and honestly think you would do well to see it off on the twisty stuff or when taking cheeky overtake options.

The Zed isn't a one-trick, understeering, nightmare-pulling-out-of-wet-junctions, compromised, boy-racer hot shoe, but a sophisticated balanced tool of pleasure, hey you already know that and that's why you want a Zed 8)
 
Boogle said:
A Corsa VXR won't get near. It handles surprisingly well (Lotus engineered handling), but it's still 160bhp from an awful engine. But must say a Focus RS (300bhp), Megane 250 (250bhp), and some of the fastest VAG hot hatches will certainly give you a run for the money.

189bhp im fact!! vauxhall were going to make it quicker apparently but knew their market was mainly boy racers and felt all responsible and down tuned
Click to expand...
 
The corsa as it is isn't capable of more power that 1.6 engine is tuned to the max, people who got it remapped at places like thorney motorsport were having the 4th piston melting on them, uprated engine parts solve the problem but still.
 
Fastest hot hatch i've tried is the Astra VXR with a slight remap, it understeered round bends and torque steered all over the place in a straight line, Just didnt feel right.
 
I am going to have to accept that hot hatches are going to be on pace with me then from the sounds of it, a shame really. I always think a proper sports car should be faster than hot hatches, nevermind hey :)
 
Totally different propositions. My previous cars have all been hot hatches: Clio 172 mk2, Honda Civic Type R, Seat Ibiza Cupra TDI. And you know what? For the first 6 months of owning my 3.0 Z4 I would've been quicker down any given road in any one of them than in my Z4! FWD hot hatches are easier to drive quickly than anything RWD - but as this is my first RWD car it's perhaps no surprise I think that. Now with more experience of the handling characteristics of RWD and the Z4 in general, I'd say the balance is slightly the other way.

But it's more the enjoyment from just drivin the car, not the outright speed, that I enjoy. Of course the speed helps but I enjoy the Z4 a lot more than any of the hot hatches perhaps I'm just getting old :D. Not to mention the fun you can have on quiet wet/icy roads and power oversteer...

There's a not a massive difference in power/weight ratio between something like the 3.0 231ps Z4 and an Astra VXR (to use an example from above):
Z4, 231ps, 1396kg = 165ps/ton
Astra VXR, 240ps, 1355kg = 177ps/ton

Interestingly, I found these Nurburgring lap times online, on a VXR website of all places. Laptimes: Z4 (SMG too) = 8m32s, Astra VXR = 8m35s. Read what you want into that.
 
Just have fun in what you have, you dont have to be the fastest thing on the road to be having the most fun. On a twisty road the Z4 or my 350Z will struggle to get away from our old Swift Sport and that only had 125bhp.
 
I had an audi S3 before the Z and to be honest, the S3 felt alot more faster and "thrilling" in a straight line, and the quattro was very very impressive.

I'm having much more enjoyment in the Z (only had it a week so far) but I perfer the nice looks you get off people, the comments, and the balanced drive. It feels so much more like a drivers car and I feel like I'm driving the car rather than pressing a button to make it go vrooooom.
 
If it helps take the argument the other way my good buddy has just sold his 911 (whatever model it was) 0ver 500hp with some special X pack engine and 4WD. Would pin you in the seat up to and from any speed you fancied.

Drive lacked any involvement and has sold it after a few months, so he's looking around and likely get an ///M and bank half the money from the sale :thumbsup:

It's not all about outright A to B performance.
 
There's simply no comparison between a Z4 and a hot hatch. There such different cars. As a comparison, I did a track day at Donington, and there was a guy with a chipped Astra VXR ( 300bhp).We were locked together the whole time with nothing in it although I think he was a better driver than me and it was my 1st car trackday.He was most impressed with my Z with "only" 231 bhp and commented that his Astra just couldn't get all the power down whereas I could use every one of my horses.Your call, only you know what you are wanting. As soon as the sun's out, all your mates will want to have your Z.
 
tyranical said:
The corsa as it is isn't capable of more power that 1.6 engine is tuned to the max, people who got it remapped at places like thorney motorsport were having the 4th piston melting on them, uprated engine parts solve the problem but still.
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The uprated engine part is a more powerful fuel injector :) There's a big article @ Thorney about it, and fyi remaps from them didn't blow the 4th piston :) You can get some crazy amounts of bhp from that 1.6 with a few select parts.

billygilly said:
189bhp im fact!! vauxhall were going to make it quicker apparently but knew their market was mainly boy racers and felt all responsible and down tuned
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My bad :oops: I'll never forget my Corsa VXR drive, handled v well (albeit with a lot of body roll). But the engine was just atrocious, no power unless you revved it and absolutely no torque low down. It drove more like a broken VTEC engine than something with a turbo. By comparison the much 'slower' Abarth Grande Punto felt much faster and was much more in-keeping with the hot hatch ethos imho.

No hot hatch matches the involvement of a Zed though.
 
I need to try myself a 3.0si as after a while i found my 2.0i abit dull as it wouldnt let you put a foot wrong, there wasnt much drama apart from the RFT's throwing in a surpirse now and then.
 
Boogle said:
tyranical said:
The corsa as it is isn't capable of more power that 1.6 engine is tuned to the max, people who got it remapped at places like thorney motorsport were having the 4th piston melting on them, uprated engine parts solve the problem but still.
Click to expand...

The uprated engine part is a more powerful fuel injector :) There's a big article @ Thorney about it, and fyi remaps from them didn't blow the 4th piston :) You can get some crazy amounts of bhp from that 1.6 with a few select parts.
Click to expand...

Depends where you read mate, read the article on thorney, and it wasn't them who caused itm Read on the corsa VXR forums, and it was thorney who caused it... i'd believe the victims over the company claiming it wasn't them tbh.
 
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