Unusual 28i ?

derin100

derin100

Active member
I’m currently in Germany and was browsing the local classifieds when I spotted this unusual 28i.
It’s white but has the Design Pure Traction interior with the Alcantara seat centres with the orange stripes and other design features etc. Interestingly, on my Valencia Orange cars, the Alcantara inserts on the door-cards are orange but not on this…???

I had thought this was exclusive to Valencia Orange cars…although I have seen one black car that seemed to have it.
I’ve never seen a white car with it.

Look at the PRICE too! Secondhand cars are MUCH more expensive in Germany !


www.kleinanzeigen.de

Gebrauchtwagen kaufen | kleinanzeigen.de

Kleinanzeigen: Gebrauchtwagen kaufen oder verkaufen - Jetzt in Hamburg Neugraben finden oder inserieren! - kleinanzeigen.de
www.kleinanzeigen.de www.kleinanzeigen.de
 
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The black seats with yellow or Orange stripes were an option on all cars from 2010-2016

And yes E89s are expensive everywhere but the UK
 
Ah! Interesting. I didn’t know the seats could be ordered independent of the whole package . Thanks.

Yes, the most expensive one that I can find on Mobil.de today is this one with 91K kilometres on the clock!



€47,500 For 2010 car with 91K km on the clock! 😮

When I sold my Alpina E85, the prices were at least 2.5 x what I was asking in the UK for mine. A guy in southern Germany, who already had an Alpina, contacted me as he was considering buying mine and converting it to LHD.
 
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derin100 said:
Ah! Interesting. I didn’t know the seats could be ordered independent of the whole package . Thanks.

Yes, the most expensive one that I can find on Mobil.de today is this one with 91K kilometres on the clock!



€47,500 For 2010 car with 91K km on the clock! 😮

When I sold my Alpina E85, the prices were at least 2.5 x what I was asking in the UK for mine. A guy in southern Germany, who already had an Alpina, contacted me as he was considering buying mine and converting it to LHD.
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The market is the market ..but…wonder why the European LHD market cars are soooo much more expensive/.especially when in theory you can but / move from many countries…
 
B21 said:
The market is the market ..but…wonder why the European LHD market cars are soooo much more expensive/.especially when in theory you can but / move from many countries…
Click to expand...
It’s because ALL consumer goods (not just cars) are much more expensive on the Continent.
I’m a dual national citizen-British and German- and spend about half my time split between the two countries.
I also had a house in France for 13 years.
All consumer goods, cars, electronical goods, washing machines, fridges, clothes are MUCH more expensive here.

It’s because these countries were far less credit-driven with accompanying cheap lending than the UK was for decades.
People in the UK had access to cheap borrowing, so a culture, for example, of changing one’s car for a brand new one every three years, as existed in the UK, never happened here..

The massive and constant flood of people buying new cars all the time in the UK means that it is also awash with secondhand cars. Supply and demand then pushes the price of secondhand cars in the UK right down.

That throwaway culture doesn’t exist to anything like that extent in Germany. For example, my German partner has owned her same Renault 19 ever since she bought it new in 1995. She sees no reason to change it.

This culture exists across the board here. You don’t need to change most things unless they are irreparably broken or worn out beyond economic viability.

Where I’m sitting now writing this I can look out of the window straight at the local Porsche maindealer. The prices of secondhand, even high-mileage, Porsches is absolutely astounding!

About the only things that are really cheap here are alcohol, if you drink, which is dirt cheap and cigarettes, if you smoke! 🤣
 
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derin100 said:
It’s because ALL consumer goods (not just cars) are much more expensive on the Continent.
I’m a dual national citizen-British and German- and spend about have my time split between the two countries.
I also had a house in France for 13 years.
All consumer goods, cars, electronical goods, washing machines, fridges, clothes are MUCH more expensive here.

It’s because these countries were far less credit-driven with accompanying cheap lending than the UK was for decades.
People in the UK had access to cheap borrowing, so a culture, for example, of changing one’s car for a brand new one every three years, as existed in the UK, never happened here..

The massive and constant flood of people buying new cars all the time in the UK means that it is also awash with secondhand cars. Supply and demand then pushes the price of secondhand cars in the UK right down.

That throwaways culture doesn’t exist to anything like that extend in Germany. For example, my German partner has owned her same Renault 19 ever since she bought it new in 1995. She sees no reason to change it.

This culture exists across the board here. You don’t need to change most things unless they are irreparably broken or worn out beyond economic viability.

Where I’m sitting now writing this I can look out of the window straight at the local Porsche maindealer. The prices of secondhand, even high-mileage, Porsches is absolutely astounding!

About the only things that are really cheap here are alcohol, if you drink, which is dirt cheap and cigarettes, if you smoke! 🤣
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Yes, The credit Culture here in the UK is nuts. Keeping up with the Jones's was the old term for it. Happily our kids haven't fallen for it. They both still buy their cars with hard earned savings. :thumbsup:
 
B21 said:
...but…wonder why the European LHD market cars are soooo much more expensive/.especially when in theory you can but / move from many countries…
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Well, the price level of the E89 is indeed relatively high and has now settled at a high level. Interestingly, prices have remained constant for years, even though the cars are getting older every year. :cool: Most owners will probably keep these cars forever. There are about 20k ! E89 registered in Germany.

@germinator is tracking the prices since years on a regularly basis:

Entwicklung Gebrauchtwagen-Angebot Z4 E89

Danke @germinator! Beobachtest du eigentlich auch die Preise (im Mittel), oder nur reine Angebotszahlen? Mein (zugegeben: subjektiver) Eindruck ist nämlich der einer recht stabilen Preisentwicklung bei den jetzt 3-4 jährigen. Da hat sich seit 2015 kaum etwas bewegt...?
www-zroadster-com.translate.goog www-zroadster-com.translate.goog
 
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RobbiZ4 said:
Well, the price level of the E89 is indeed relatively high and has now settled at a high level. Interestingly, prices have remained constant for years, even though the cars are getting older every year. :cool: Most owners will probably keep these cars forever. There are about 20k ! E89 registered in Germany.

@germinator is tracking the prices since years on a regularly basis:

Entwicklung Gebrauchtwagen-Angebot Z4 E89

Danke @germinator! Beobachtest du eigentlich auch die Preise (im Mittel), oder nur reine Angebotszahlen? Mein (zugegeben: subjektiver) Eindruck ist nämlich der einer recht stabilen Preisentwicklung bei den jetzt 3-4 jährigen. Da hat sich seit 2015 kaum etwas bewegt...?
www-zroadster-com.translate.goog www-zroadster-com.translate.goog
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There are still 17k-18k E89s in the UK too!
 
B21 said:
There are still 17k-18k E89s in the UK too!
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True...but they are quite rare.
If you compare prices with Germany, pretty much across the board for comparable cars, the prices in Germany are double (at least) the price for the same E89 in the UK.
 
derin100 said:
True...but they are quite rare.
If you compare prices with Germany, pretty much across the board for comparable cars, the prices in Germany are double (at least) the price for the same E89 in the UK.
Click to expand...

Yes I get that ..but the point in neither country are they THAT rare…

I was surprised how many F types were made as I did think they were ‘niche’..I guess not many in Germany
 
B21 said:
Yes I get that ..but the point in neither country are they THAT rare…

I was surprised how many F types were made as I did think they were ‘niche’..I guess not many in Germany
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But, the point is EVERY secondhand car in Germany is vastly more expensive than the UK! This irrespective of what it is or how rare it is.

It is not a phenomenon that has its basis in an individual car's make, model or rarity etc. It doesn't matter whether E89s are rare or common in either country. It is across the board of ALL cars.

For comparison, I have just searched on the UK Autotrader and Mobile.de for the most boring, run of the mill, old type of car that I could think of. I thought of a 2008 VW Golf TDi with about 100k miles on the clock.

This is a circa £2k car in the UK. In Germany, these are consistently over €5000 !
 
This shows how high inflation in the EU, especially in Germany is. But, don't assume that salaries have doubled or tripled in the last couple of years. 8-)
 
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The population of the EU is 450 million people and they all drive LHD except Cyprus, which has expensive import tax for cars.

Once the cars are finished with in Europe they can easily be shipped over to Africa.

The same applies in the USA, when the cars are done with they can be sold further south.

Cars in the UK have a limited after sale market and it's too expensive to ship a £5k car to Australia, Japan, Cyprus etc.... and then pay the import taxes.

Tractors in the UK, once uneconomical to run due to maintenance costs, are still worth good money as they can be sold to poorer countries in the EU and Africa.
 
RobbiZ4 said:
This shows how high inflation in the EU, especially in Germany is. But, don't assume that salaries have doubled or tripled in the last couple of years. 8-)
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This does not account for the price differences when comparing the UK vs Germany.

Whilst peak inflation over the last 3 years hit 7 - 8.7% in Germany in 2022, mainly due to the effect of the pandemic and crisis in Ukraine before dropping again to 2-3%, it hit 11% in the UK!

Inflation has and is also presently consistently higher in the UK than Germany.

So, inflation has always been higher in the UK.

Furthermore, those price differentials between German and UK secondhand car prices already existed BEFORE any increases in inflation in both countries prior to those more recent levels. Inflation was low in both countries for a long period but the price differences ALREADY existed for cars (and most other manufactured consumer goods, as well).

In fact, the price difference on secondhand cars, comparing the UK vs Germany was EVEN greater pre-Covid!

This is because the price of secondhand cars has actually seen an increase in the UK post-pandemic.

I hadn't been back to or spent time in Germany for over 15 years when I started coming back again regularly from 2019 onwards.

I was absolutely shocked! Cars that would have been considered almost worthless scrap in the UK still had a significant value in Germany and were being sold for decent money!

I was also utterly aghast at how the price of property had changed. That is in both the rental and purchase markets.

Property used to be REALLY cheap in Germany, especially compared to the UK.

In the UK, we consider property in France to be relatively cheap. However, I remember when I bought my house in France in 2010, Germany was even cheaper than France! For that reason, I wanted to buy in the Black Forest, near Freiburg, instead. However, my now ex-wife wouldn't entertain it because she didn't speak German but could speak French!
Now, France is really cheap compared with Germany.

At that time, even apartments in Berlin were dirt cheap. I have an English friend who, in 2008 after the global financial crisis, between himself and his two brothers, bought the entire Berlin property portfolio of a Japanese company, consisting of 50 apartments, for €50,000 per apartment! That is now SO unbelievable!

Virtually every German city is now very expensive. Even northern cities like Hannover, where I go and where my family is from, which were previously cheap are nowvery expensive. More fashionable cities like Munich are simply unbelievably expensive!

Basically, everything in Germany (now including property) is more expensive in than the UK. The only things that I can think of that are much, much cheaper much are alcohol and cigarettes! 😅

But, ALL secondhand cars always were and still are miles more expensive in Germany.
 
I can't explain all your above but the culture in Germany was never strong in buying a property. They were always happy to rent for life.

Germany is the powerhouse of Europe, they paid better wages. Lots of people would commute to work in Germany to get the better wages from other parts of Europe. This started in 2004 when it became obviously easier and has slowly snowballed since then. There's also been a huge amount of immigration into Germany in the last 15 years. I assume in the last 15 years people have settled there and bought houses.

The minimum wage across the EU has put a stop to anything being cheap, especially if coming from the UK. When I last had a holiday in Greece (2022?) I found it comparible to the UK for eating and drinking.

Anyway, going back to cars. A lot of eastern Europe source their cars from Germany. As the cars move east and get older they then have Poland. The Polish are highly creative in repairing and maintaining cars. They can also make/refurbish obsolete parts that are no longer available to an oem standard to keep cars going longer.

I don't know much about Lithuania but they also seem to have a hand in the automotive industry. I assume that storage is cheap there because they seem to buy old BMW parts stock. Parts that are no longer available from a BMW dealer in the UK can be had new from Lithuania.

P.S if anyone wants a cheap weekend break in Europe I highly recommend Sarajevo. Airport is 15 mins from City centre, flights £30 each way, 3 nights in a skyline apartment in center of Old Town £200 and food and drink is very cheap. Amazing place full of history. If you want an insight of what's happening in Ukraine right now then a trip to Sarajevo will give you a good post-apocalyptic experience of that.
 
Usel said:
The population of the EU is 450 million people and they all drive LHD except Cyprus, which has expensive import tax for cars.
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Malta is in the EU and they drive on the left!
 
Usel said:
I can't explain all your above but the culture in Germany was never strong in buying a property. They were always happy to rent for life.

Germany is the powerhouse of Europe, they paid better wages. Lots of people would commute to work in Germany to get the better wages from other parts of Europe. This started in 2004 when it became obviously easier and has slowly snowballed since then. There's also been a huge amount of immigration into Germany in the last 15 years. I assume in the last 15 years people have settled there and bought houses.

The minimum wage across the EU has put a stop to anything being cheap, especially if coming from the UK. When I last had a holiday in Greece (2022?) I found it comparible to the UK for eating and drinking.

Anyway, going back to cars. A lot of eastern Europe source their cars from Germany. As the cars move east and get older they then have Poland. The Polish are highly creative in repairing and maintaining cars. They can also make/refurbish obsolete parts that are no longer available to an oem standard to keep cars going longer.

I don't know much about Lithuania but they also seem to have a hand in the automotive industry. I assume that storage is cheap there because they seem to buy old BMW parts stock. Parts that are no longer available from a BMW dealer in the UK can be had new from Lithuania.

P.S if anyone wants a cheap weekend break in Europe I highly recommend Sarajevo. Airport is 15 mins from City centre, flights £30 each way, 3 nights in a skyline apartment in center of Old Town £200 and food and drink is very cheap. Amazing place full of history. If you want an insight of what's happening in Ukraine right now then a trip to Sarajevo will give you a good post-apocalyptic
Click to expand...

RobbiZ4 said:
This shows how high inflation in the EU, especially in Germany is. But, don't assume that salaries have doubled or tripled in the last couple of years. 8-)
Click to expand...
Als Beispiel...

Kaum zu glauben, ne?
 
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