What constitutes "full service history"?

[Pondrew]

Interested in people's opinions on what they consider to be a worthwhile full service history on a car.

I am in discussions to purchase a car but am not willing to pay the asking price because the service history can't be relied upon from my point of view. The car seems a good one, but I am thinking of walking away as it is a risk IMO.
It only has a service book with 12 stamps in; all dated, all signed, all mileage recorded, all at the correct intervals. OK fine. BUT that is all the owner has; no paperwork, invoices, receipts, nothing (apart from a handful of MOT certs which I can find online anyway).
My worry is that I have no idea what was done, when, on these services. For all I know the previous owners could have just had an oil change each time to get a stamp in the book. It could have a 15 year old air filter, plugs and brake fluid!

The car is only on 55k miles, so the services look good as they were all carried out 'early' on the mileage. The seller is bemused by my questions; he seems to think the service book is all that is required and can't understand my worries. :?

 

[Owdgit]

This was my point to a certain degree, my car has a full service history and is stamped up but no receipts to say what was done, just the ticks against items in the service book.
I'm doing the servicing from now on and will be keeping a record with receipts and images to prove what has been done but some on the thread I started said it would put them off buying it if it wasn't stamped in the book!
I write on the air and pollen filter the date and mileage changed, I have the old plugs and pictures of the brake fluid being changed.
Maybe if the car looks OK and you are competent you could then complete a service yourself or if you have a mechanic you trust get them to do it.

 

[Nictrix]

Not everybody keeps paperwork.
I would bet that there are far more cars out there for sale with fsh and no other paperwork than cars with folders full of stuff.
It's only going to get worse now that cars don't even get a service book.

 

[B21]

What about modern service records with no paper records these days ?

I’m not aware of many folks who are as anally retentive…

Of course you haven’t explained what car is it?

Most modern cars only change oil and filters anyway?

 

[Pondrew]

Not everybody keeps paperwork.

I get that, but for a 17 odd year old car to have absolutely nothing at all seems a little 'strange' to me. I would expect at least a few old receipts somewhere, especially as it has had only 3 owners.
I am also thinking about when I move it on; would the lack of paperwork de-value it against others that do have a 'folder full'?

 

[Dark Diggler]

I'm the only person I know that keeps invoices and documents work done in detail.
I would imagine the people who serviced it would have records of work carried out.

 

[smorris_12]

It depends on the car really. Enthusiast cars will likely have a paper trail an inch thick but with more average cars most people don't give a fig about what happens when it goes in for a service or even have a clue what's required at what service. They give someone money and assume some magic happens that will appease the breakdown fairies. "Local garages" are, as far as I can tell, a random play of "nothing beyond an oil change" or "full set of filters and spark plugs whether it's time for them or not." All the owner knows is that they've got the prized stamp that You and Yours or Watchdog bang on about and, surely, that's all there is to it.

And that's not to say cheap cars either. I've known people with high end cars (Merc S-Classes, Range Rovers, etc) not even begin to worry about either how they treated them or how they were serviced. People just treat cars as a means of transportation. They're not interesting enough to care about beyond how good the badge looks on the drive.

I'm not even sure it's even worth worrying about, particularly as cars get older, without going insane with the possibilities of other things happening. Who knows what has happened to a car over 10/15/20 years? How many times would an oil thirsty engine not get a timely topup? How many times has someone forgotten to put the radiator cap back and boiled out a load of the water (did that once with my E36)? How many dinks, scrapes or dents have been painted over, pulled out or otherwise hidden?

Cars are bloody hardy things so go by current condition and hope it'll be ok. I bought a Discovery some years ago as a do-er-up project for a friend to then run. An utter shed of a Y-reg TD5, 13 years old at the time, with 10 previous owners and 170k on the clock. I did all the obvious things that wanted doing and it ran for 5 years and 50k miles without great problems. That is to say bits fell off at regular intervals or broke but it never failed to proceed. One of the things I happened to do was to wipe out the inside of the sump and, for about 30-40k after that, it never dirtied its oil noticeably between changes in typical Diesel fashion. It darkened but never went instantly black. So in all that time and all those owners the piston rings were sealing like champs. It finally blew its heater matrix in the depths of winter and it was unceremoniously dumped in a hedge for the thick end of a year. And then a local came past, paid me what I'd paid for it in the first place, took it away, did it up and I still see it sailing past occasionally.

 

[Ole gits rule]

I'm the only person I know that keeps invoices and documents work done in detail.
I would imagine the people who serviced it would have records of work carried out.

Nope, I do the same, even down to key rings & mats for every car including the Corsa.

Pondy,

The thing is if you like it buy it and get it serviced for peace of mind, if you keep it more than the 3 weeks you normally keep a car then keep all the receipts you get.

 

[Pondrew]

Pondy,

The thing is if you like it buy it and get it serviced for peace of mind, if you keep it more than the 3 weeks you normally keep a car then keep all the receipts you get.

I will be able to gauge quite a bit by looking at it in the flesh, agreed. I know it is overdue for a service (the seller has offered to service it or 'pay' for a service to be done by me).
It's the previous 17 years that concern me, paperwork-wise. I try to buy the best cars I can find, I don't buy crap. For my peace of mind, future owners' peace of mind and residual values. A paperwork trail starting now is a bit pointless TBH.
The car in question isn't cheap (for what it is), so I want to make sure it is what it is being sold as, ie a "good 'un".

 

[Ole gits rule]

Pondy,

The thing is if you like it buy it and get it serviced for peace of mind, if you keep it more than the 3 weeks you normally keep a car then keep all the receipts you get.

I will be able to gauge quite a bit by looking at it in the flesh, agreed. I know it is overdue for a service (the seller has offered to service it or 'pay' for a service to be done by me).
It's the previous 17 years that concern me, paperwork-wise. I try to buy the best cars I can find, I don't buy crap. For my peace of mind, future owners' peace of mind and residual values. A paperwork trail starting now is a bit pointless TBH.
The car in question isn't cheap (for what it is), so I want to make sure it is what it is being sold as, ie a "good 'un".

I agree a paper trail starting now is not that great, however, you could by a car with every receipt and it could have been driven by every 18 year old knob head in the UK so abused to hell, by the opposite thought could have zero paperwork and drive for 10 years with no issues.

For me I always like to see paperwork but also know not everyone is like me so have to judge by the owner and the car when I view it.

Again it depends on the car, if its a cross then doesn't matter as bits are cheap, if its a 911 then better to be cautious and want some proof or work done, cant you get an image of the service book and make a few calls to the garages to see what they can tell you about it.

 

[Pondrew]

cant you get an image of the service book and make a few calls to the garages to see what they can tell you about it.

Got that, done that. It's been serviced by many different dealers over the years (and some specialists), some are more helpful than others. Most are pretty unhelpful TBH.

 

[Ole gits rule]

cant you get an image of the service book and make a few calls to the garages to see what they can tell you about it.

Got that, done that. It's been serviced by many different dealers over the years (and some specialists), some are more helpful than others. Most are pretty unhelpful TBH.

Shame - you would think most would want to help but they are only interested in quick bucks these days, I would have though most main stealers would help, I know BMW were good when I asked for a new service book for the Zed, came all stamped up where applicable.

 

[Pondrew]

Shame - you would think most would want to help but they are only interested in quick bucks these days, I would have though most main stealers would help, I know BMW were good when I asked for a new service book for the Zed, came all stamped up where applicable.

Yep had lots of help with BMW dealer and especially MB. This lot are a different kettle of fish. No 'centralised database going back that far' is what I keep being told. I think it is a polite way of saying, 'feck off unless you want to spend money with us'.

 

[Ole gits rule]

Shame - you would think most would want to help but they are only interested in quick bucks these days, I would have though most main stealers would help, I know BMW were good when I asked for a new service book for the Zed, came all stamped up where applicable.

Yep had lots of help with BMW dealer and especially MB. This lot are a different kettle of fish. No 'centralised database going back that far' is what I keep being told. I think it is a polite way of saying, 'feck off unless you want to spend money with us'.

Then this is something exotic and best to leave it alone unless you got a warranty with it

 

[Pondrew]

hen this is something exotic and best to leave it alone unless you got a warranty with it

It's definitely not exotic! :lol:

 

[Ole gits rule]

Well it cant be a cavalier can it :rofl:

 

[rdgreen]

I do all my own maintenance and servicing but have no stamps in the book either.....but I know the job has been done, and done correctly. Whether this affects the value at resale is yet to be tested. I would go more on the condition of the car rather than not having reams of paperwork with it. What if it had all the paperwork but was flogged to death, or even worse, used on daily 5 minute journeys?

 

[Argyll Andy]

Well it cant be a cavalier can it :rofl:

:rcard: :rcard: :rcard: :rcard: :chairfight: :chairfight: :violent1: :violent1: :violent1:

 

[MikeyH]

Well I heard someone say somewhere that when a dealer gets a car the first thing they do is bin all the paperwork due to the new privacy rules. :headbang:

 

[MikeyH]

For God’s sake Pondrew what the hell is this car. A ‘plastic pig’? :rofl: