WANTED - Z4 M AP Big Brake Kit Front and Rear

[pHilli0]

Cheers mate. The easy answer is lots! KW Clubsports; adjustable camber plates and top mount reinforcement up front; RE top mounts at the rear; stiffer, adjustable H&R ARBs front and rear with adjustable drop links; VT competition engine mounts; CDV delete; braking cooling ducts; braided hoses; DOT 5.1 fluid; EBC Bluestuff pads; AFE intake with RPi scoop; Remus backboxes; pedal covers with homemade adjustable throttle pedal extension (aids heel and toe); CG Lock (great for keeping you planted in the seat); light weight wheels and soft compound semislicks; a few little things under the hood, some for preventative maintenance and others to eek out a couple more horses; cosmetics such as aeroskirts, black grills, stubby, fang protectors etc. I've also fitted an aux lead and up to date nav disc - they don't make it faster but they do make journeys seem quicker
Soon to come are solid brake bushings (ordered) and maybe a stage II ESS supercharger (still considering the head vs heart man maths on that one).

Holy Sh1t !! Niiiiice... The second half of your list makes sense but the suspension stuff whizzes past me in a blur of wtf... but I know I need some of that for me over time.. hmm I need to find out more about that stuff

 

[BMWZ4MC]

I forgot to mention the RTAB limiters and strut brace too
I knew something about suspension set up from having my Westfield for years (and a lifelong interest in cars and dismantling things), but I've certainly learned lots more from this forum

 

[Anonymous]

Would the below be something of interest?? Look like serious bits of kit!!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E46-M3-CSL-365mm-Alcon-Big-Brake-Kit-front-/121170065415?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c364c7807
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E46-M3-CSL-343mm-Alcon-Big-Brake-Kit-Rear-/121170066519?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c364c7c57

 

[TomK]

Would the below be something of interest?? Look like serious bits of kit!!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E46-M3-CSL-365mm-Alcon-Big-Brake-Kit-front-/121170065415?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c364c7807
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E46-M3-CSL-343mm-Alcon-Big-Brake-Kit-Rear-/121170066519?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c364c7c57

If you were to go with these you should check they fit the Z. The AP m3/Z4M kits are very slightly different, the bell housing of the rotor has a 2mm difference IIRC, brackets and calipers the same. Due to the E36 front strut we run I guess.

 

[GuidoK]

Nice stuff from alcon in those ads.. Also with semi floating front disks, so very suitable for track work. It's not very clear but to me it seems that these calipers are without dustboots, so if that is so, this is definately a track oriented set.


Strange that AP has a different bell housing on the front rotor. Stock z4m rotors are afaik the same as e46 m3 csl discs (stock m3 rotors being 20mm smaller but the same otherwise)

 

[simonlpearce]

This any use to the OP???

http://forums.m3cutters.co.uk/showthread.php?t=127953

Based near bath.

Copy Paste from add...
M3 E46 Ap racing big brake kit front and rear complete.

The fronts are not very old and are the latest 5575 model and have only had light road use no track days ect they have ds2500 pads which are just over quarter worn the discs have no lips cracks ect and are in excellent condition and everything is there ready to fit complete with fitting instructions manuals everything.

The rear kit is brand new in the boxes and has only been removed to photo i also purchased the ap rear discs to match the front discs.

The only kit in stock at the time was a black rear kit so either the fronts will want painting satin black or spray the rears red or do a custom colour of your own.

I DONT WANT TO SPLIT THE KIT AND SELL SEPARATELY SO PLEASE DONT ASK.

Price £2600.
I would prefer collection but delivery can be arranged for £50.

 

[pHilli0]

This any use to the OP???

http://forums.m3cutters.co.uk/showthread.php?t=127953

Based near bath.

Copy Paste from add...
M3 E46 Ap racing big brake kit front and rear complete.

The fronts are not very old and are the latest 5575 model and have only had light road use no track days ect they have ds2500 pads which are just over quarter worn the discs have no lips cracks ect and are in excellent condition and everything is there ready to fit complete with fitting instructions manuals everything.

The rear kit is brand new in the boxes and has only been removed to photo i also purchased the ap rear discs to match the front discs.

The only kit in stock at the time was a black rear kit so either the fronts will want painting satin black or spray the rears red or do a custom colour of your own.

I DONT WANT TO SPLIT THE KIT AND SELL SEPARATELY SO PLEASE DONT ASK.

Price £2600.
I would prefer collection but delivery can be arranged for £50.

MANY thanks for posting this here.. The only issue is the APs for the E46 fronts are a different kit from the Z4M kit fronts. There are mods that are required to get them to fit (Bells / bolts / clearance issues etc) :headbang: The rears are like for like though. Shame he wont split them or I would of snapped them up.

 

[simonlpearce]

Can you not just modify/make up a new carrier? This can be done cheaply, around £100 or so. The discs can't be any different since you can run CSL discs on the E46 without issue.

 

[pHilli0]

Can you not just modify/make up a new carrier? This can be done cheaply, around £100 or so. The discs can't be any different since you can run CSL discs on the E46 without issue.

Yea makes sense I guess. Do you think the price is OK?

 

[BMWZ4MC]

Would the below be something of interest?? Look like serious bits of kit!!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E46-M3-CSL-365mm-Alcon-Big-Brake-Kit-front-/121170065415?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c364c7807
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E46-M3-CSL-343mm-Alcon-Big-Brake-Kit-Rear-/121170066519?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c364c7c57

The fronts definitely don't fit. I bought front and rear kits after long discussions with the vendor. The front discs are the wrong offset for our cars as they foul the track rod ends. Alcon won't make a disc for our cars - I asked them! Fortunately, I kept all the emails in which the vendor guaruanteed the kit would fit my car, so he had to give me a full refund (but only once I envoked the Trade Description Act and Distance Selling Regulations). I expect the rears would be ok but I didn't get as far as trying them.
Essentially, CSL discs fit all M3s and Z4Ms but the not all aftermarket M3 or CSL kits will fit the Z4M. There is less horizontal clearance for thicker or higher offset discs on the Z4M.
The same is likely true of the AP kit for the M3 but at least AP make a specific kit so this could be modified to fit.

 

[pHilli0]

Would the below be something of interest?? Look like serious bits of kit!!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E46-M3-CSL-365mm-Alcon-Big-Brake-Kit-front-/121170065415?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c364c7807
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E46-M3-CSL-343mm-Alcon-Big-Brake-Kit-Rear-/121170066519?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c364c7c57

The fronts definitely don't fit. I bought front and rear kits after long discussions with the vendor. The front discs are the wrong offset for our cars as they foul the track rod ends. Alcon won't make a disc for our cars - I asked them! Fortunately, I kept all the emails in which the vendor guaruanteed the kit would fit my car, so he had to give me a full refund (but only once I envoked the Trade Description Act and Distance Selling Regulations). I expect the rears would be ok but I didn't get as far as trying them.
Essentially, CSL discs fit all M3s and Z4Ms but the not all aftermarket M3 or CSL kits will fit the Z4M. There is less horizontal clearance for thicker or higher offset discs on the Z4M.
The same is likely true of the AP kit for the M3 but at least AP make a specific kit so this could be modified to fit.

Bingo.. I saw some info in other threads about them not fitting but they didn't cover any where near that detail! Thanks again bro, saved me thinking about buying that used set So the basic message is if you want APs.. buy the specific Z4M AP front kit and either E46 or Z4M rear kit So can I ask what you did in the end then if you went down this road? Are you running a BBK now? I am going to do the "cheapo" mod.. hoses, fluid and attempt some ducting which will be an improvement but I know I want to go BBK eventually..

 

[simonlpearce]

Can you not just modify/make up a new carrier? This can be done cheaply, around £100 or so. The discs can't be any different since you can run CSL discs on the E46 without issue.

Yea makes sense I guess. Do you think the price is OK?

Can't really comment on price, what are the new?

 

[BMWZ4MC]

I've fitted braided hoses, EBC Bluestuff pads and cooling ducts to otherwise stock brakes and I'm running DOT5.1 fluid. I've found that I can absolutely hammer this set up on the track with the only issue being some inconsistency of pedal feel when they brakes are really hot. I'm awaiting delivery of solid bushings that I hope will solve this.

However, it's important to note that changing to KW Clubsports from the stock suspension has led to sufficient improvement in brake function for me to continue with the OEM discs and calipers. When I was running Eibach springs with stock dampers the car would pitch violently under heavy braking. This offloaded the rear and rapidly overheated the front brakes whilst the rears weren't pulling their weight. My car now remains flat under heavy braking, so allowing all four corners to contribute to the braking effort. Also, since the car corners flat and is running on decent track rubber, I can carry more speed through the corners so reducing the need for such dramatic deceleration. I still eat pads at an alarming rate though, so I might yet upgrade at some point. If I do, it will be to a K Sport BBK as they have been shown to match the performance of the big players when fitted to an E46 M3 but at half the price.

 

[pHilli0]

I've fitted braided hoses, EBC Bluestuff pads and cooling ducts to otherwise stock brakes and I'm running DOT5.1 fluid. I've found that I can absolutely hammer this set up on the track with the only issue being some inconsistency of pedal feel when they brakes are really hot. I'm awaiting delivery of solid bushings that I hope will solve this.

However, it's important to note that changing to KW Clubsports from the stock suspension has led to sufficient improvement in brake function for me to continue with the OEM discs and calipers. When I was running Eibach springs with stock dampers the car would pitch violently under heavy braking. This offloaded the rear and rapidly overheated the front brakes whilst the rears weren't pulling their weight. My car now remains flat under heavy braking, so allowing all four corners to contribute to the braking effort. Also, since the car corners flat and is running on decent track rubber, I can carry more speed through the corners so reducing the need for such dramatic deceleration. I still eat pads at an alarming rate though, so I might yet upgrade at some point. If I do, it will be to a K Sport BBK as they have been shown to match the performance of the big players when fitted to an E46 M3 but at half the price.

Hmmmm you make some good points there with the suspension setup. To prevent me from going bankrupt tomorrow after buying a new suspension setup lol would you say the Eibach springs / oem dampers offer enough of an upgrade over stock or just save up for a proper set like the Clubsports etc..? I do hear ppl running the Eibachs as a "cheap option".. and once I have paid for my $$$ engine rebuild I want to make improvements where I can at reasonable cost.

 

[BMWZ4MC]

I bought Eibachs because one of my OEM rear springs snapped and it was cheaper than buying from BMW. As a bonus, they marginly improved the handling and significantly improved the appearance by lowering the car slightly.
If you're planning frequent track use or can't get on with the excessive pitch and roll from the stock set up, then you'd be better off buying decent adjustable suspension that you can set up for road and track. If you just want to improve the appearance of the car, then get Eibachs or H&R springs.
Personally, I didn't find the "soft front, hard rear" stock springs as bad in normal use as some other forum regulars, but I did find the entirely stock set up gave very vague handling at extremely high speed (>125mph or so). This was cured with the Eibachs, but Eibachs are no substitute for a proper track-focused set up. My Clubsports are epically good on the track but I'm too lazy to adjust it between track days, so driving it on the road breaks my teeth.

 

[BMWZ4MC]

If your choice is adjustable suspension or a BBK, I'd modify the suspension every time. You'll gain on the road and on the track (and may no longer need a BBK), whilst a BBK just gives you extra bling 95% of the time and performance 5% of the time.

 

[Beedub]

phil the clubsport dampers are incredible so so so good, the a game changer for this car imo, beautifully made items as well that fitted in place, linear springs, helper springs, SS cases, bump and rebound , spherical bearings, GT3 Rs levels of awesomeness...

my braking also improved dramatically, one of the first observations i noticed, the car barely pitches or squats now...

 

[pHilli0]

phil the clubsport dampers are incredible so so so good, the a game changer for this car imo, beautifully made items as well that fitted in place, linear springs, helper springs, SS cases, bump and rebound , spherical bearings, GT3 Rs levels of awesomeness...

my braking also improved dramatically, one of the first observations i noticed, the car barely pitches or squats now...

Oh my God I am cracking under the pressure LOL they sound immense..argh! I am a suspension complete noob.. " linear springs, helper springs, SS cases, bump and rebound , spherical bearings" - ???? huh

 

[jpeeters]

If your choice is adjustable suspension or a BBK, I'd modify the suspension every time. You'll gain on the road and on the track (and may no longer need a BBK), whilst a BBK just gives you extra bling 95% of the time and performance 5% of the time.

I'd go the other way around - but my driving profile might be different (50% track, 30% on my way to the track and 20% road). Steel brake hoses, ATE blue, Pagid RS29 etc is nice - but I'm more hampered by the braking capacity then the suspension (with Eibach pro kit). BBK is first on my priority list, than Bilstein / KW.