Shock GT86, Autocar's best drivers car of the year
- Thread starter sars
- Start date
bigshurv said:
I understand what you're saying but politely disagree. A good balanced turbo twin scroll for example ( or twin sequential i guess) will spool so early as to make no difference what so ever. Even a NA has a usable power band which you're trying to keep within to exploit on the track or for fast road driving. As far as only good in a straight line I take your NA and raise you an Audi Quattro, or a delta, or in fact almost anything group B I guess you could say the were only using them for the hike in power and I'd guess you were right but they certainly went round corners fairly fast ( and sometimes into ditches or the crowds)
As far as big single scroll number makers I totally agree, the 1200hp skylines for example normally have turbos so big they'd suck a small house ino them and the power bad is so narrow really drag racing is all they can be optimised for.
I'm coming from a different angle bacause I've driven a few laps of Donington in a GT86, so I know how well balanced it is,how light on it's feet it is, how easy to place,easy to slow down etc. I'm sorry, but you simply CANNOT compare a hot hatch to a purpose built coupe.Yes, a Clio may be faster in a straight line,big deal. Once you've had it flat out a few times, a car needs more than straight line speed to make it interesting.Front drivers are easy to drive hard, they pull themselves round corners and cover bad driving.Rear drivers punish poor driving and are tricky to drive hard.There's the interest from petrolheads.Group B cars,impossible to drive unless supremely talented and going stupidly fast. I've watched guys try to drive Quattro's round a tight course at Stoneleigh for the last 4 years in February,loads of understeer ( it literally won't change direction) until the turbo spools up,then it tries to turn 360 on itself.A right proper handful. All the steering is done with the throttle.Great rally car,scary road car. I've had turbo front drivers, they have a place, maybe in your garage, but not mine.Don't slag off the GT86 until you've had a good drive in one,it's a very talented car.
I totally understand what your saying about group b and would agree, what I was disagreeing with is the turbo spool up of all turbo cars. Apart from diesels the only other turbo I've had was 4 wheel drive but 300+ HP and 380+ torque with naff all turbo spool up once you know the sweet spot and shift points. I had mine remapped to smooth this out further with the mods I put on and unless you started at 2000rpm in any gear you wouldn't even feel when the car came on boost just a linear power progression not to dissimilar to a NA car. I can pull away in 3rd gear in my 3.0i but it still would take some time to hit the sweet spot that's the point I was making.
Obviously modern turbo racers also run anti-lag so this is further reduced, you can have this on a road car but the engine life would be considerably reduced.
Obviously modern turbo racers also run anti-lag so this is further reduced, you can have this on a road car but the engine life would be considerably reduced.
I supplied the launch fleet at Donington with in car camera systems for a week (23 cars) and had one to drive for a week. It was a great deal of fun and the front was connected to the road very well indeed. Turn in was precise and feedback was beautiful.
All you have to keep in mind is that its a £25k car!
The line that was being pushed by Toyota was all pointed at practical affordable fun. They really wanted people to understand that the practicality of the car to be used as a track day tool! the boot with the seats folded down can take 3 spare wheels (fourth is in the spare wheel well). with room for a tool box, jack and racing overalls.
The car is very light by modern day standards (just over 1250kg), and every body knows, weight is the enemy of a sports car.
The fact that is fitted with Prius tyres to make sure that the tyres were affordable because of their size.
I liked it! when it gets in to the 2nd hand market, it would be great to have as that track toy. not uber powerful, but allows lots of driver skill to shine through.
My opinion only!
All you have to keep in mind is that its a £25k car!
The line that was being pushed by Toyota was all pointed at practical affordable fun. They really wanted people to understand that the practicality of the car to be used as a track day tool! the boot with the seats folded down can take 3 spare wheels (fourth is in the spare wheel well). with room for a tool box, jack and racing overalls.
The car is very light by modern day standards (just over 1250kg), and every body knows, weight is the enemy of a sports car.
The fact that is fitted with Prius tyres to make sure that the tyres were affordable because of their size.
I liked it! when it gets in to the 2nd hand market, it would be great to have as that track toy. not uber powerful, but allows lots of driver skill to shine through.
My opinion only!
sars said:a11y said:
Yes seen a few too, they look good in red, the only real distraction for me was the wheels, the just look stupidly small and thin, and this coming from a girl that thinks 19" are too big
Totally agree! Most of them I've seen look under-wheeled! That could help the handling mind! :wink:
Most tests I've seen or read states it's underpowered also but the handling is fantastic!! Looks OK.
I wonder what that new Vauxhall Astra VXR is like on it's 20" wheels!!
I watched the ECOTY video last night and Tiff Needell really did not look like he was having fun driving the GT86. The video is worth a watch.
The price is a problem no matter how the car is targeted. There are far better and faster road cars such as the new Focus ST for less money than this and as a track car it's just too expensive for most people. I'd argue that an EP3 type R would be as much fun on track for a couple of grand. Or if you really must have RWD an e36 or the answer to everything..... MX5.
I've only seen one in the flesh at the Geneva motorshow and it looked like someone had tried to make their hyundai coupe look fast. The tiny brakes gave it away.
The price is a problem no matter how the car is targeted. There are far better and faster road cars such as the new Focus ST for less money than this and as a track car it's just too expensive for most people. I'd argue that an EP3 type R would be as much fun on track for a couple of grand. Or if you really must have RWD an e36 or the answer to everything..... MX5.
I've only seen one in the flesh at the Geneva motorshow and it looked like someone had tried to make their hyundai coupe look fast. The tiny brakes gave it away.
wabbitkilla
Member
:roll: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11587
Not without its problems though.
I come from Toyota sporting fun, so far MR2 owners going for test drives are finding it ..... uninspiring.
Obviously they are jumping from mid-engined rwd to front-engined rwd, so there will be obvious differences.
The GT86 is five years too late and five years out of date upon release. Don't believed all the press says, they are being paid to make people want to buy it.
Not without its problems though.
I come from Toyota sporting fun, so far MR2 owners going for test drives are finding it ..... uninspiring.
Obviously they are jumping from mid-engined rwd to front-engined rwd, so there will be obvious differences.
The GT86 is five years too late and five years out of date upon release. Don't believed all the press says, they are being paid to make people want to buy it.