Roof motor not working - pump failure or electrics?

G

ginkster

Member
Hi all

Today my roof has packed in and stopped working :( I had the roof down and when I came to put it back up it moved slightly then stopped working. I pulled & twisted the red release handle in the boot and raised the hood by hand and managed to get it to lock down but now it won't lower again. There is no motor noise. The locking mechanism on top of the windscreen is working fine and the fuse (No 31) is OK. I have also obviously reset the red emergency handle in the boot and checked that the moveable compartment floor is fully lowered. I use the roof a lot and it has been working perfectly until today so it is not an issue with it having not being used over winter. Having searched the forum I believe there are a couple of potential issues that I have not already looked at:

1. The roof pump/motor has failed. This should be unlikely as the motor was replaced in Oct 09 as the previous one had failed due to water ingress :thumbsdown: Obviously if it has it should be covered by the warranty though that is slightly complex as it was paid for by the independent dealer I bought the car from rather than me and I don't have a copy of the invoice. Also, I would have to pay for the investigation work and hope that the garage is truthful on what the cause is!
2. The electrical connection to the roof motor has become disconnected. As the locking mechanism is working fine and the fuse is OK then it is not a complete electrical failure, however as the motor is not running at all I wonder if the electrics to the pump have failed.

So the question is, has anyone come across the electrics failing to the roof motor? Is there a connection anywhere that I should check (I have had a look in the little access panel in the shoulder area behind the passenger seat) that may have come loose?

Also, there is a fair amount of play in the wire of the red emergency handle so it is possible that the bypass valve has not returned properly. If this is the case I would expect to still hear the motor running. Is this a fair assumption?

Many thanks.
 
Eek, sorry to hear that.

Yes if the bowden cable was at fault it would make a noise, just not do anything.

It sounds unlikely it needs a new motor again, but possible. I think you need to get to the connections on the motor to check for power, but I don't think you can do this without roof-off again, which is the hard bit.

They definitely replaced and didn't refurb it?

Back luck matey, I'd get onto the Indi for an Invoice for the work either way, sounds needed. Assume everything electric works as it should, and there's no lights when you use the button?
 
can you let me know if you find out the problem....i have the same issue with my 2005....bmw z4 2.5......exact same problem...
 
Sorry to hear about your motor ,i know how you feel as i replaced my motor several weeks ago , you said there is slack in your bowden cable just to let you know that you can adjust the tension, if you follow the cable from the red handle around 12 - 16 inchs away you will see the adjuster screw in or unscrew and check handle, going back too my pump it was the brass nipple that the bowden catch pushs in had seized so 1, the hood wouldnt work and two couldnt move manually hope this helps
 
dannylee said:
can you let me know if you find out the problem....i have the same issue with my 2005....bmw z4 2.5......exact same problem...
Click to expand...
the motor is a common failure
 
What happened to this Mate have exactly the same problem, no motor noise and the red light on roof operation still works! Also the lock on windscreen works and no fuses have blown!!
 
Might be worth having a scroll through 'Z dead roof' thread for the micro switch issue.
 
stirz said:
Sorry to hear about your motor ,i know how you feel as i replaced my motor several weeks ago , you said there is slack in your bowden cable just to let you know that you can adjust the tension, if you follow the cable from the red handle around 12 - 16 inchs away you will see the adjuster screw in or unscrew and check handle, going back too my pump it was the brass nipple that the bowden catch pushs in had seized so 1, the hood wouldnt work and two couldnt move manually hope this helps
Click to expand...


I have a trouble to open my soft top also. When i push the down button, front part of the soft top is opening but after i can not here the motor noise therefore soft top does not move. I tried to pull red handle but it is stuck. From what you post there is a way to adjust the tension of the cable to pull. But i could not understand. is there any way to open th soft top manully without using the red handle cable?
 
are you sure the red pull doesnt work?

you pull it out about 5mm, and turn it so it doesnt go back in. this will disable the hydro unit so you can pull the roof up and down, (down is easy, up is pretty heavy)

The answer is a new motor, which is what many people do. expect to pay £1000+ at a stealer, £500-600 at an indi and £250 plus a few hours of your time if you do it yourself.

I took my roof off today to have a look (had nothing better to do) and my motor is corroded, just waiting for the part to come to fit it.
 
Think my motor is buggered as well. When I press the button, the roof unlatches and motor continues to make a noise but doesn't move until I lightly thump it underneath. It then continues to open without a problem and closes without any intervention. I'm going to try to move it manually and oil the latches/hinges tonight to see if that loosens things up. Even if it doesn't it's not too much of a worry - thankfully its a BMW AUC (bought in April) so will be covered by warranty.

Only problem is I'll miss having it for this lovely weather! :headbang:
 
koolchris99 said:
are you sure the red pull doesnt work?

you pull it out about 5mm, and turn it so it doesnt go back in. this will disable the hydro unit so you can pull the roof up and down, (down is easy, up is pretty heavy)

The answer is a new motor, which is what many people do. expect to pay £1000+ at a stealer, £500-600 at an indi and £250 plus a few hours of your time if you do it yourself.

I took my roof off today to have a look (had nothing better to do) and my motor is corroded, just waiting for the part to come to fit it.
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Many thanks for your reply. This is the specific, critical answer to hear for me. I applied much force to pull out. i wish i had not damaged the hydro bypass unit i try and report back to the forum....
 
No don't pull if it won't come up.. You have to wait for a slight click noise when you twist the red cable pull don't pull to hard, then tryoving it manually!
 
Leon_in_uk said:
No don't pull if it won't come up.. You have to wait for a slight click noise when you twist the red cable pull don't pull to hard, then tryoving it manually!
Click to expand...


Last night i was in my garage to try again. red handle either it does not work or i am incapable of doing this.
I followed your directions. I pulled the red handle 5 mm (the orginal position of the handle the "o" shape looking towards to surface) and turn 90 degree ("o" shape looking towards to my vehicle) I did not hear any click noise coming from the hydraulic valve. The noise i only heard was red handle friction noise to its clamp when i turned. I tried push down the soft top but it was going no where down. Maybe i did not apply much force to push, maybe ı was afraid of damaging the mechanism of the soft top. I really need your advice again.

Maybe posting a picture and step by step d.i.y documentation helps many people like me. If ı searched the forums many people is complaining abaout the red handle stuck in postion or don to know what to do.

Thank you in advance.
 
Maybe your handle is broke like stirz was, it was this not his motor!! Try and keep twisting the red handle until it makes a click either way will do, iv done this many a time with mine to test if the motor works or not!! But twist and if you hear a louder click not grinding on the plastic the roof will go down freely
 
I am not sure what everyone is talking about, this 'click' when you pull out the 'hydraulic bypass' red handle. When my softtop motor was broken, I used the bypass handle at least once a day for a month until I fixed the faulty motor. Never heard a 'click'.

What I think is happening is people are hearing a click from just the cable contacting the tube. This click is not required to set the bypass and is NOT stated in ANY BMW documentation.

If you have extreme corrosion from water intrusion then your bypass valve could be corroded and will not activate, since it is physically attached to the motor. The actual plunger that is pressed or activated only moves about 2 mm to allow the hydraulic oil to flow through the motor with out the motor running allowing you to manually move the softtop.

Someone also talked about the electronics. If you press the open button and the top unlocks from the windshield and the top either does not move or moves slightly then the electronics are working properly and the most likely cause is the motor. If your trunk micro-switch is working and set properly, then the top will unlock. If the micro-switch is not working or not set properly, then the top WILL NOT unlock... period... and the top will not move at all. This is because the electronic interlocks have not been cleared to safely unlock and open the top. BUT.. with a micro-switch that is faulty or not set properly, the top WILL raise up from the open position, close and lock to the windshield.

When I set the bypass, I pull out and place the cable into the notch in the cable tube. That insures it is set and will not slip out. That being said, as I stated above, if the bowden cable assembly on the motor is extremely corroded, pulling the cable may not activate the bypass.

Someone also said that the wiring harness needs to be replaced when you replace the faulty motor. Unless the harness is physically faulty, this is not necessary. 99% of the time a new harness is not needed. I can imagine that one in a great while a harness MAY need to be replaced but not as a standard procedure.

Even if you don't properly set the bypass, you can SLOWLY with continuing constant pressure, move the top from closed to open. The hydraulic lines are very small and the fluid must move through the motor, but you can do it. I would not do this regularly, mainly to open the top to the correct position to remove the top from the car and replace the motor..

The black 'box' under my thumb is the bypass actuation arm.... The cable next to my index finger is the cable that actuates the arm.
101_0085.jpg


Now you can see the bypass plunger. It is the out of focus copper colored ball on the motor. You can see that it will not depress very far...
101_0086.jpg
 
I am new to this forum so if I am not in the right posting please direct me to the right one. I have just replace my top motor on my 2003 Z4. I did it myself following the direction posted on Shipkiller"s site ( Thank you Shipkiller, I could not have done it without your guide). Now my top goes up and down now but it seems to go thru the cycles slower than it did before ( now takes more than a minute to bring the top up and slightly less to bring it down but before it took 5 to 10 seconds). I hear the top motor running all the time I press the up or down button but the top move in a jerky motion. If I run it up and down 4 or 5 times in a row it seems to work faster then but when I try it later on it is still slow. Does anybody know what could be the problem.

Your help is much appreciated.
 
Maritimer said:
I am new to this forum so if I am not in the right posting please direct me to the right one. I have just replace my top motor on my 2003 Z4. I did it myself following the direction posted on Shipkiller"s site ( Thank you Shipkiller, I could not have done it without your guide). Now my top goes up and down now but it seems to go thru the cycles slower than it did before ( now takes more than a minute to bring the top up and slightly less to bring it down but before it took 5 to 10 seconds). I hear the top motor running all the time I press the up or down button but the top move in a jerky motion. If I run it up and down 4 or 5 times in a row it seems to work faster then but when I try it later on it is still slow. Does anybody know what could be the problem.

Your help is much appreciated.
Click to expand...

Could you hydraulic system need bleeding? I have never done this, but you must have broken into the fluid system to change the motor.
 
mintstuff said:
Maritimer said:
I am new to this forum so if I am not in the right posting please direct me to the right one. I have just replace my top motor on my 2003 Z4. I did it myself following the direction posted on Shipkiller"s site ( Thank you Shipkiller, I could not have done it without your guide). Now my top goes up and down now but it seems to go thru the cycles slower than it did before ( now takes more than a minute to bring the top up and slightly less to bring it down but before it took 5 to 10 seconds). I hear the top motor running all the time I press the up or down button but the top move in a jerky motion. If I run it up and down 4 or 5 times in a row it seems to work faster then but when I try it later on it is still slow. Does anybody know what could be the problem.

Your help is much appreciated.
Click to expand...

Could you hydraulic system need bleeding? I have never done this, but you must have broken into the fluid system to change the motor.
Click to expand...

I noticed that when I changed motor that I had lost a little bit of hydraulic fluid but when I check the fluid level it was above the + line. Does anyone know how to bleed the fluid system ?
 
Eeeks does that mean taking the roof off again?? Did everyone do this alone? Or does it really need 2 people to take the roof off?
 
NO BLEEDING IS NEEDED. It's self bleeding.

Are you sure you torqued the hydraulic lines properly. eg. tight enough?

If not, you COULD be getting air in the system and a couple of cycles bleeds out the air. AND you could have a small leak. The oil will come out the bottom drain system.
 
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