Reasonable service estimate?

[LichMike]

Newbie here...a couple of months in to Zed ownership and looking to work out a rough maintenance budget over the next few months.

My 2004 2.5i SE has service history, but not all that comprehensive. She’s running fine.

It’s at 68k miles with the last stamp being at 62k (but I believe a couple of years back - no date on the stamp, handy!) and just an ‘oil service’ tick at an independent.

It had an oil service, inspection 1 and air filter at 48k (again, not dated!) - independent.

Prior to that an air filter at 42k - independent.

Inspection 1 at Sytners at 31k in Nov ‘11.

Inspection 1 and pads at 24k in Dec ‘10 - independent.

First entry in the book being an oil service at Sytners at 14k in Apr ‘08.

My local independent has quoted for a ‘full service’ - I’m just waiting on some more details of what exactly that includes for the £330 they’ve quoted - but they have mentioned a full inspection, with brake inspection and clean inclusive of their £330.

I’m guessing at some point I should get the auto gearbox serviced too? Any ideas on what I should expect to pay there?

What are the key things you guys would recommend need checking up on, and, does anyone know of any reputable and valuable BMW specialists in the West Midlands area?

 

[Rockhopper]

Auto boxes are sealed for life - fluid changes are not recommended unless its playing up.

 

[Davz]

It all depends what you get for the money, if it's just oil, filter, cabin filter and brake inspection it's a total rip off.
A full service should include a brake fluid change not just an inspection, this should only cost £40. Is the garage fitting new spark plugs? If so what type..... standard £3 each or NGK iridium £13 each? Are the filters Mann and not some cheap copies? What is the make of oil.....mannol £25 for 6.5l or miller's £50.
If the service is just oil/filter and inspection walk away.
Best BMW indy in the west midlands is autotech, Telford but be aware that they are primarily a BMW specialist such is their reputation that they now work on Ferrari, lotus, Aston etc and prices have risen accordingly.
Why not do the service yourself? I made some long Ramps out of wood decking to make it real easy and quick to do an oil change. Bleeding brakes is dead easy with a bleed kit from halfrauds. Cabin filter change 5 mins. Not changed the plugs yet but that looks easier than changing the oil! This gives you piece of mind that it's been done properly.

 

[groovy_hippy]

Generally stuff that isn’t dealing with fluids I do myself - it’s too much faff getting rid of oil and brake fluid for me.

Hence, spark plugs, coil packs, air filter and cabin filter I’ve always done and then paid for an oil service and brake fluid at my local indy (think it was about £220 the last time I had it done)...

 

[Mr Tidy]

I had a service done by Sytner on my 1st E86 3.0Si for the new owner when I sold it in 2016.

It was oil and filter, microfilter and fresh brake fluid and cost £260.32 inc. VAT.

Same thing in 2019 for my 2nd 3.0Si cost £200.00 at my BMW Indy, and included a diagnostic check on my A/C.

£330 at an Indy sounds dear, but you'd need to know exactly what they are doing.

 

[LichMike]

Thanks for the feedback.

So the £330 is for Bosch spares - plugs & filters - and £50 worth of oil (no brand mentioned). Goes to £400 for brake fluid too. Labour rate £55/hr.

I also got a quote from Hughes Brothers in Derby (saw them recommended on another thread) - they came in at £417 - no mention on brands of filters, plugs or oil on their quote and a labour rate of £80/hr.

So those two are fairly level pegged - albeit my local is within walking distance.

For another comparison I just looked on Sytners Tamworth website - estimate below:


I’m not sure I can justify £240 extra for the privilege of BMW doing the work.

As for me doing the service, I couldn’t trust myself with that - technical capability about as novice as it comes!

 

[tug]

Why not do what i do. I always buy my own filters, plugs, fluids, & oils (the oil is always millers or fuchs) Then my indie does the service & stamps the book. He always does a full inspection while he has the zed and comprehensive report on any area that needs attention.

This for just £70. I purchase the parts when there is an offer on, in between services.

Cheers, tug

 

[Toed64]

I am always astonished that BMW main dealers are so extraordinarily expensive. On cars as old as ours, a main dealer stamp would mean precious little to me. To me, a record of service, wherever it's been done is much more important...and actually, I'd be more convinced that the work has actually been completed if the owner has kept a record of the jobs they've done themselves, or done by a good local garage. For jobs that I don't do myself (and this depends on mood and spare time!) I use a local garage that's run by people I know and trust.

There's a comment above about transmissions being 'sealed for life'. Honestly, this is part of the BMW smoke and mirrors nonsense. BMW does not make its own gearboxes and diffs, they source from companies like ZF. The automatic gearboxes do have filters that are normally part of the oil pan (not cheap - over £200) and can be serviced. When fitted to other vehicles, the manufacturers do recommend service for gearboxes and diffs. So yes, if you want it right and plan to keep the car for some time, it is worth doing. Changing the diff oil only takes a few minutes and the diff oil volume is only about 1 litre, so it's not expensive.

When my favourite garage dropped the diff oil out of my 135i when it was 5 years old and had done just under 50,000 miles, the oil was so filthy, they kept it to show me becasue they were concerned about the condition of the components. It was dark grey and had a silver metallic sheen. The fresh oil was clear and pale yellow. The diff was fine and continued to work faultlessly for the next years during my ownership. I know the current owner of that car and he changed the diff oil again recently. It's now 10 years old and has about 76,000 miles on the clock. He said it was slightly murky, but still golden...

 

[M1k3yC]

What are the key things you guys would recommend need checking up on, and, does anyone know of any reputable and valuable BMW specialists in the West Midlands area?

My Z goes to BM Automotive Solutions (https://bmautomotivesolutions.co.uk/) for MOTs and preventative maintenance. My Z and my 1 series go to Sytner Tamworth for routine servicing and to keep the full BMW service history. Sytner Tamworth often reduces the first price I'm quoted for work on the Z if I ask politely - BMW dealers normally discount servicing for older cars (which means it becomes only a little expensive instead of very expensive :wink: ).

BM Automotive Solutions changed the manual gearbox oil, rear differential oil, and coolant for me on the Z this year. That was all unscheduled, preventative work.

 

[Danglesberries]

Thanks for the feedback.

So the £330 is for Bosch spares - plugs & filters - and £50 worth of oil (no brand mentioned). Goes to £400 for brake fluid too. Labour rate £55/hr.

I also got a quote from Hughes Brothers in Derby (saw them recommended on another thread) - they came in at £417 - no mention on brands of filters, plugs or oil on their quote and a labour rate of £80/hr.

So those two are fairly level pegged - albeit my local is within walking distance.

For another comparison I just looked on Sytners Tamworth website - estimate below:
F67D3C94-3A52-4B2D-9607-D447A85DD533.jpeg

I’m not sure I can justify £240 extra for the privilege of BMW doing the work.

As for me doing the service, I couldn’t trust myself with that - technical capability about as novice as it comes!

£315 for an air filter and 6 spark plugs!!! They're having yer pants down, thieving gits :thumbsdown:

 

[Rockhopper]

Just going back to changing fluid in auto boxes, if you search Google you’ll find many cases of people having problems with their auto box after having the fluid changed, indeed a local specialist BMW workshop near me refused to do mine when I asked about having it done for that very reason. They only change fluid if there is a problem with the box.
Sealed for life was perhaps the wrong choice of words as it is possible to change the fluid and filters - it’s just not needed (according to BMW).

 

[Toed64]

Most of the automatic BMWs of this age are fitted with the ZF 6HP19 gearbox, they are also fitted to lots of Audis and some other VAG cars of the era. They are excellent when in good condition, more efficient than earlier designs of automatic transmissions because the torque converter locks in every gear. The reports of problems are often at higher mileage.

Audi and BMW both say silly things like 'sealed for life', but they are boxes of metal things meshing together under heavy torque and they do wear. The Audi specialist my friend favours, is now suggesting a 40,000 or 50,000mile auto tranny service interval.

I've run several 4x4 automatics in the last 20 years. Mostly Japanese. They all had recommended service intervals for their transmissions. 3 litre Subaru Outbacks have a 30,000 mile transmission service interval and the transmission oil filter is mounted remotely for ease of service.

It's almost impossible to get all of the muck out of the torque converter, although some automatic transmission specialists use a flushing and filtration procedure. Consequently, I think that preventative maintenance is sensible and to change the fluid and filter can avoid future issues.

Interesting - I have not heard of problems being caused by replacing the fluid and filter. I shall read more.

 

[LichMike]

Hence, spark plugs, coil packs, air filter and cabin filter I’ve always done and then paid for an oil service and brake fluid at my local indy (think it was about £220 the last time I had it done)...

In which case, it doesn't seem too unreasonable...looking at the Bosch parts they've listed on the quote on Euro Car Parts, they're sourcing the filters and plugs slightly cheaper than I could, and will make a much better job than I would!

As for the gearbox, something to keep reading up on - looks like pretty mixed opinion.

 

[Chris_D]

Save money by getting clued-up and doing services yourself. Oil, coolant, brake fluid, plugs, coils, filters and other consumables are a piece of cake to change once you know how and have the right tools.
Get a PELA pump for oil changes, dump your old oil into old containers and take down to your local tip/recycler. Couldn't be easier!

At 68k miles and if you intend to keep the car until it 'dies' then DIY servicing makes total economic sense.
If stamps in the service book are important and you want to throw money away by getting your pants pulled down at ripoff indys/main dealer then carry on..

 

[kis]

I'd say you need an Inspection 2 from the look of that. If they're a BMW specialist they should call it that, and not just say full service :scratchhead: seems a bit strange to me. Plus seem slightly on the expensive side, but does depend on what is included in the mystery service!

I just got an Inspection 1 and an MOT at RBM at Hampshire for £190. You've got the benefit of the M54 engine so in between "stamped book services" I do my own as well (oil service can be done via the dipstick tube). Just keeps things fresh. I'd echo above with some of the other fluids (particularly under car like gearbox), it can be messy so sometime easier just taking the car to someone but try do what you can? It'll make a big difference, you can even pay yourself the £55/hr to do it :wink:

I would recommend that you get the gearbox oil changed. Maybe differential oil too. No such thing IMO as lifetime oil or filter irrespective of what a marketing team say. Logically, its just not possible.
Then there is the DISA and the vanos...
Brake fluid would be a good idea, unless you know it's been changed recently?
Another thing to put on the list would be roof motor relocation.

sorted! Don't forget to drive it :driving:

 

[Mike6]

Not been mentioned but paying for 'Inspection' is always a bit of a joke when its all covered more comprehensively by the MOT. Garages are just charging twice in effect for inspection and MOT. I think by main stealer standards if you can kick the tyres thats the inspection over.

 

[LichMike]

Then there is the DISA and the vanos...

Another thing to put on the list would be roof motor relocation.

The roof relocation is deffo on the list...I’ll be trying to find a Midlands based contact in the new year who might be able to help - I’ve seen mention of ‘Durham Dave’ in threads, wondering if there’s someone more local to me.

In terms of DISA and Vanos, what are the tell tale signs something is wrong there? I’ve read varying threads, some saying it’s almost like you don’t know there’s a problem until you have it overhauled and all of a sudden the car breathes and comes to life so much more than before.

 

[colb]

Number5 is down on the outskirts of Bristol who relocates and fixes roof motors for reasonable money, pm him on the forum for details or he may well respond on this thread. I did my own using the guide on here, doable but getting the tie wraps that hold it in the well is a faff, managed to force mine upwards using a long bar on a built up pivot point in the boot to snap the ties, easy to extract it and pull it back into the boot to relocate it then.

 

[Mr Tidy]

The roof relocation is deffo on the list...I’ll be trying to find a Midlands based contact in the new year who might be able to help - I’ve seen mention of ‘Durham Dave’ in threads, wondering if there’s someone more local to me.

Probably the nearest to you for a roof motor relocation is Mike at ZedShed in Cheshire, but a few people have had issues with him in the last couple of years.

If you want to read the whole sorry saga on this forum here is a link:- https://z4-forum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=105182

I took my Z4 to him in 2016 before he had premises and he replaced my rear brake pipes in copper and cut and coded a flip-style key for me for £180 - very happy with that!

Or I think forum member "PDJ" in Manchester, or sometimes Cleethorpes, does them too.

 

[kis]

In terms of DISA and Vanos, what are the tell tale signs something is wrong there? I’ve read varying threads, some saying it’s almost like you don’t know there’s a problem until you have it overhauled and all of a sudden the car breathes and comes to life so much more than before.

You may not be able to tell. Not sure specifically off the top of my head for DISA, but vanos is supposed to increase performance, back to stock.
The DISA is straighforward to rebuild (there are aluminium kits available). Just be careful when removing as the pin can fall out, if it's loose. AFAIK its a myth the pin can fall out and blow up the engine. There isn't enough clearance for the pin to fall out if the DISA is installed, hence be careful when removing. Vanos you can leave on the back burner unless you need a new rocker cover gasket? In which case I'd get it done at the same time.

Out of everything I'd stick to your service, brake fluid as priority.
Then think about DISA, coolant flush, gearbox and diff oil.
Then vanos and roof right at the end.