Hi! Help me pick a Z4! :)

[TomTomST]

Hi guys.

Unfortunately my Fiesta ST has just been written off. Looking to get another car. Felt like a soft top. Wanted a Honda S2000 originally but insurance is too high.

So this brings me to the Z4.

I have a few questions though. These will all be based around the '04 plates probably as I can't afford much more. (22 years old)

1) What are the engine sizes? 2.0, 2.2, 2.5 & 3.0?
2) My 2006 Fiesta was 150bhp. 0-60 in 7.5 secs & 140 lbs/ft of torque. I was averaging about 29-31mpg from this. Don't particularly want something less powerful.
3) What's the deal with trim levels? I REALLY want heated seats. My ST had them and I love them.
4) How much are tyres roughly? I normally have michelin Pilot Sport 3's & what size are they?
5) I've been told BMW's cost a bomb to maintain. true?
6) How reliable are these? Any problems with the roofs?

I'm just starting to look into them. At the moment it's a toss up between getting a 185Bhp Fiesta ST, Focus ST or Z4

thanks!

 

[Darren Slone]

Hi and welcome to the forum, you've made the right choice

Some great questions there too, I'm only familiar with the running costs of an ///M but I'm sure someone with more experience will be along soon to guide you through the E85 cars

 

[Carol M]

Hi and welcome ^^^^^ what Darren said.

 

[andysat]

Hi and welcome-what Darren and Carol said

 

[TomTomST]

As much as I'd love an M. I don't think it will happen. My insurance is VERY expensive as it is, especially after my poor ST being written off.

I'm thinking maybe the 2.5 as it's slightly quicker than my old Fiesta ST (2.0 incase you aren't familier with them). I know you don't buy larger cars and worry about mpg, but I do a lot of miles, so need to consider it.

I'd consider the 2.0 or 2.2 for a nice spec though. Going to try and test drive a few tomorrow, see what they are like.

 

[danmiddle2]

Get a 6cylinder - I believe the 2.2, 2.5 and 3.0 are all 6cyl.

Depending on driving I get about 27mpg from my 3.0SI (later 3.0 with a few more horses).

Problems with the roofs? yes - the motor floods.

Just replaced my rear tyres with premium brand non-runflats at £170 per tyre fitted.

Bear in mind even driving slower the Z is likely to be more fun than a hot hatch, even if the model you get isn't quite as fast.

Good luck!

 

[TomTomST]

Couple of pics of the old car too + The problem!!

 

[TomTomST]

Get a 6cylinder - I believe the 2.2, 2.5 and 3.0 are all 6cyl.

Depending on driving I get about 27mpg from my 3.0SI (later 3.0 with a few more horses).

Problems with the roofs? yes - the motor floods.

Just replaced my rear tyres with premium brand non-runflats at £170 per tyre fitted.

Bear in mind even driving slower the Z is likely to be more fun than a hot hatch, even if the model you get isn't quite as fast.

Good luck!

That's pretty good for a 3.0. So I imagine the 2.2/2.5 may get approx the same as my Fiesta.

Is that if you put it up and down quickly? Or it just randomly does it? What sort of cost are you looking at to fix? Or is it a DIY fix?

£170 is pretty expensive! What size tyre is that? £130 for Pilot Sport 3's for 205/40/17 on the Fez.

Yeah, my friend who has an MX5 says that, just how the car is. Never fancied the MX5s though. Hot hatches have come on such a long way now, they can rival a lot. The new Fiesta ST is 1.6 turbo petrol, 180bhp with overboost at 200bhp. 6.8 to 60!

Handling has to be a big factor for me too. The MK6 ST was one of the best for handling in it's class. Where does the Z4 rank?

 

[TomTomST]

How do these actually sound too with a standard exhaust?

 

[danmiddle2]

Get a 6cylinder - I believe the 2.2, 2.5 and 3.0 are all 6cyl.

Depending on driving I get about 27mpg from my 3.0SI (later 3.0 with a few more horses).

Problems with the roofs? yes - the motor floods.

Just replaced my rear tyres with premium brand non-runflats at £170 per tyre fitted.

Bear in mind even driving slower the Z is likely to be more fun than a hot hatch, even if the model you get isn't quite as fast.

Good luck!

That's pretty good for a 3.0. So I imagine the 2.2/2.5 may get approx the same as my Fiesta.

Is that if you put it up and down quickly? Or it just randomly does it? What sort of cost are you looking at to fix? Or is it a DIY fix?

£170 is pretty expensive! What size tyre is that? £130 for Pilot Sport 3's for 205/40/17 on the Fez.

Yeah, my friend who has an MX5 says that, just how the car is. Never fancied the MX5s though. Hot hatches have come on such a long way now, they can rival a lot. The new Fiesta ST is 1.6 turbo petrol, 180bhp with overboost at 200bhp. 6.8 to 60!

Handling has to be a big factor for me too. The MK6 ST was one of the best for handling in it's class. Where does the Z4 rank?

From what I read before buying, the 3.0 may actually be more economical by virtue of the 6sp box. Only had a 3.0 so can't confirm. Don't get me wrong, on a hoon, it drops significantly.

The motor fails due to the drain holes getting clogged with debris and flooding the motor itself (not happened to me, but I have only been a Z4 owner a short while). Regular cleaning of the drains should reduce the likelihood. If it happens, there is a manual override for the roof. It is, I understand, a time consuming DIY job.

£170 is cheap compared to what I am used to... guess it's all a matter of perspective. I *think* they are 235/35/18's on mine... but don't quote me on that without checking in daylight. Bear in mind, I tend to put top rubber on.

Hot hatches are definitely easier to drive on the limit and are damned fast, but I'd take a slower RWD car and have more fun going slower. Know what you mean about the MX5 though - nice cars, bit petite for me.

I find my Z4 handles really well. The main criticism reviews levy against it is a supposed numbness to the electric steering. TBH, it's not a seven... but it makes my Saab 9-3 Aero feel like a bus. I would imagine, compared the ST - you will feel a lot more involved. I test drove a Z4, Boxster, S2000 and an SLK... I went for the Z. I wouldn't want to have to argue it was better per se, but certainly meets my needs better.

 

[TomTomST]

Ah, didn't realise the 2.5 was a 5 speed too. That's not good. The ST needed 6 gears. Just revved too high on the motorway. Anyone know what rpm the 2.5 sits at when on 70mph?

My Insurance quote comes back the same for a 3L. I may considor it! MPG dependent. Is it only the newish Z4's that are hard top?

So the flooded motor is repairable on the cheap, albeit time consuming. Good to know. High maintenance costs is a worry of mine.

Talking of Saab 9-3 Aeros. Discovered one not long ago when it pulled away from me, ignored them before & it Surprised me. Got home & had to google the specs.

Why did you go for the Z4 over those other cars? Those are all ones I think are quite nice, and obviously similar class. I didn't even look at the boxster as its too expensive though, along with SLK.

 

[Ste]

Alright Tom,

With regards to your op:

1) Correct, the 2.0 comes with a four cylinder engine though whereas the 2.2, 2.5 and 3.0 are six.

2) My 3.0 Z4 theoretically does 0-60 in 5.7 seconds with 213bhp according to this. My current MPG is about the 30 mark with mostly town driving and a bit of country roads. As with alot of cars, its alot about how you drive it with regards to what economy you get, on a long steady motorway run you can be knocking on the door of 40. As mowflow once said to me, you can drive it like a gentleman or drive it like a bitch and it really is night and day the way you feel in the car as to how you drive it. In terms of insurance/tax/mpg there's really not a lot of difference between the 2.5 and the 3.0 so I'd really say if you can, go for the 3.0 or you'll regret not.

3) The vast majority of Z's do have heated seats, its just a case of looking for one with the option. Other options which some have and some don't you may want to consider are cruise control, multi function steering wheel, and the carver sound system.

4) I've just fitted a new set of Vredestein Ultrac Sessantas to my Z, cost £430 from camskill (had to pay fitting on top), and they're tremendous tyres. Most Z's come with 17" wheels which i think run 225/45/17 usually but many people myself included opt to upgrade to 18" with a staggered setup. As with anything its up to yourself how cheap or expensive the tyres are by virtue of what sort of level you go for.

5) Running costs are no more then you'd expect really, tax for the 3.0 is currently £280 for the year, if you want to keep it serviced you'll need a few quid ready, and then there's the petrol costs because you just want to drive and drive and drive these things.

6) Quality german engineering in the main and these engines can all but take a bomb hit, as long as you find a decent well looked after one reliability is fine. Roof motors do sometimes fail due to water ingress, which you'll find loads of information about on here, and failed rear springs are a re-occuring issue for many with OEM springs, but that's not a particularly pricey repair and you can upgrade with some better aftermarket springs.

These cars really are a joy to drive, low down, fast, powerful, noisy, great to look at and built to be driven hard and fast, but with the added luxury of being just as fun to drop the hood and take a nice leisurely drive if you fancy it.

Good luck

 

[BlueBolt]

What happened to cause that damage to your Fuzzy?? That's quite a slam to the rear?? Was it a case of unexpected lift off overstear or was it something hitting you??

If it was the first, then I'd imagine the Z4 is not the car for you as it will kill you!!

If it was the second then go for it!! Get one, look out for one at the right price and you'll not loose out on it!! If you don't like it then sell it and buy a "booring" Focus ST (booring because even the tuned ones are slow!!) or similar....
Just my 2p worth

 

[TomTomST]

What happened to cause that damage to your Fuzzy?? That's quite a slam to the rear?? Was it a case of unexpected lift off overstear or was it something hitting you??

If it was the first, then I'd imagine the Z4 is not the car for you as it will kill you!!

If it was the second then go for it!! Get one, look out for one at the right price and you'll not loose out on it!! If you don't like it then sell it and buy a "booring" Focus ST (booring because even the tuned ones are slow!!) or similar....
Just my 2p worth

Yep, Oversteer got the better of me. No other cars involved.

If it was my first car you mean? I've had a few cars, 1.1 Citroen C2, Citroen C2 VTS, Ford Fiesta ST & a Vauxhall Corsa B that Just keeps going and going, I keep SORNING it and use it when I'm looking for a new car so never pressured into buying. Like now. Plus it has great MPG for me to go miles out of my way looking for the perfect car.

I think I've gone off the idea of a Focus ST now. It's really a toss up between this or the 200bhp Fiesta ST, like I had before. However, insurance isn't too much more on a 3.0L Z4. I won't say how much as you'll have a heart attack probably, but relatively speaking, it's not much more compared to other vehicles. The tax on the ST is £220 a year, so not much less! Got an average of 31mpg on the old ST. Could get about 36 on a run if I was really, really careful. However, the MR200 Fiesta will be high 20s on average - So there really isn't much difference on running costs from what I can see. Tyres + Parts & any BMW service if I did that. Joys of Ford is parts are cheap.

 

[NeilP]

DON'T get the 6 cylinder. Mine keeps encouraging me to drive. Gets expensive. :lol:

 

[TomTomST]

Alright Tom,

With regards to your op:

1) Correct, the 2.0 comes with a four cylinder engine though whereas the 2.2, 2.5 and 3.0 are six.

2) My 3.0 Z4 theoretically does 0-60 in 5.7 seconds with 213bhp according to this. My current MPG is about the 30 mark with mostly town driving and a bit of country roads. As with alot of cars, its alot about how you drive it with regards to what economy you get, on a long steady motorway run you can be knocking on the door of 40. As mowflow once said to me, you can drive it like a gentleman or drive it like a bitch and it really is night and day the way you feel in the car as to how you drive it. In terms of insurance/tax/mpg there's really not a lot of difference between the 2.5 and the 3.0 so I'd really say if you can, go for the 3.0 or you'll regret not.

3) The vast majority of Z's do have heated seats, its just a case of looking for one with the option. Other options which some have and some don't you may want to consider are cruise control, multi function steering wheel, and the carver sound system.

4) I've just fitted a new set of Vredestein Ultrac Sessantas to my Z, cost £430 from camskill (had to pay fitting on top), and they're tremendous tyres. Most Z's come with 17" wheels which i think run 225/45/17 usually but many people myself included opt to upgrade to 18" with a staggered setup. As with anything its up to yourself how cheap or expensive the tyres are by virtue of what sort of level you go for.

5) Running costs are no more then you'd expect really, tax for the 3.0 is currently £280 for the year, if you want to keep it serviced you'll need a few quid ready, and then there's the petrol costs because you just want to drive and drive and drive these things.

6) Quality german engineering in the main and these engines can all but take a bomb hit, as long as you find a decent well looked after one reliability is fine. Roof motors do sometimes fail due to water ingress, which you'll find loads of information about on here, and failed rear springs are a re-occuring issue for many with OEM springs, but that's not a particularly pricey repair and you can upgrade with some better aftermarket springs.

These cars really are a joy to drive, low down, fast, powerful, noisy, great to look at and built to be driven hard and fast, but with the added luxury of being just as fun to drop the hood and take a nice leisurely drive if you fancy it.

Good luck

Cruise control is another feature I would really like. When you're trying to drive economically it is very nice! I would also like some decent iPod connectivity. From looking at the dash board, I can't see that you would be able to fit an after market head unit? Not really looked into the steering wheels yet. My initial impression was the M had controls on it & the others didn't. A lot of people seem to get hold of an M steering wheel though.

I'm ok with paying that for tyres, I've seen some scary figures quoted for the Z4 though!

I think it's the grey Z4 I would go for too, looks soooo nice.

What are the higher milage Z4's like? Because I'm going to be looking at the cheaper end of the scale I'm probably looking at 2003 - 2005 with 80K (if im lucky) to 100K ish on the clock. Any advice?

On another note, this one looks nice. and would be the sort of price id be paying. What is depreciation like too?

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/bmw/z4-roadster/bmw-z-series-z4-roadster-2003-se-3-0l-manual/1392906

 

[TomTomST]

DON'T get the 6 cylinder. Mine keeps encouraging me to drive. Gets expensive. :lol:

Oh the things I would do for a Z4 Coupe. =D

I'm also wanting a Z4 to get away from the ''boy racer'' scene. Not saying I was one.

But let's be honest, the whole ST/RS range screams boy racer.

 

[NeilP]

I totally agree.

Is there any reason you don't want a coupe? (They only come with the 3.0 block though)

 

[Ste]

Cruise control is another feature I would really like. When you're trying to drive economically it is very nice! I would also like some decent iPod connectivity. From looking at the dash board, I can't see that you would be able to fit an after market head unit? Not really looked into the steering wheels yet. My initial impression was the M had controls on it & the others didn't. A lot of people seem to get hold of an M steering wheel though.

I'm ok with paying that for tyres, I've seen some scary figures quoted for the Z4 though!

I think it's the grey Z4 I would go for too, looks soooo nice.

What are the higher milage Z4's like? Because I'm going to be looking at the cheaper end of the scale I'm probably looking at 2003 - 2005 with 80K (if im lucky) to 100K ish on the clock. Any advice?

On another note, this one looks nice. and would be the sort of price id be paying. What is depreciation like too?

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/bmw/z4-roadster/bmw-z-series-z4-roadster-2003-se-3-0l-manual/1392906

Cruise and Aux input/intravee are pretty easy retrofits which you'll probably be able to do yourself so don't let those put you off a car as such. Sterling Grey is a great choice, looks really good with the lines for me (hence why I chose it too)

There's alot of these around on relatively low miles due to being used as garage queens/weekend cars etc so finding a low mileage model that's reasonably priced (mine was on 55k when I bought it) isn't out of the question but like I said the engines are pretty bulletproof so a well looked after and serviced 80k+ isn't anything particular to worry about.

Have a look at the classifieds section here for whats selling/sold recently to give you an idea of costs/specs/options etc:
http://z4-forum.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=41

 

[TomTomST]

I totally agree.

Is there any reason you don't want a coupe? (They only come with the 3.0 block though)

Cost. They seem to start from around 10K

6K is what I'm looking to spend, 7K at a push for a nice spec, lower miles etc. But I can't give it another 3K unfortunately.

I am looking at the 3.0 now, seeing as there is no insurance price difference, MPG is pretty much the same & not much in tax.

I'm guessing maintenance costs are the same too really?