Buying & repairing Cat D vehicles.

[Ducklakeview]

There was a heated debate recently in a sales thread regarding Cat D's, where the OP hadn't disclosed that the car in the ad was in fact a Cat D.

Anyway the subject of reselling repaired Cat D vehicles surfaced, and a few people commented that there was no money in it, and that they should not be sold on etc, one poster even went so far as to insult my intelligence

Well, just as an example as to what is possible, I have a winning provisional bid in on a 10,000 mile 2013, 63 plate Fiat 500 Lounge. The car has VERY light damage to the rear bumper, and a small dent in the tailgate, NO other damage.

Now, how many cars that people have bought in the past could well have sustained that sort of damage, and they have not been told about it?
Probably a good few, however it is VERY minor damage, and both panels will certainly repair, in fact I'm thinking the tailgate may just require a PDR, and just the bumper to paint. Now yes, it has been Cat D'd BUT I would certainly be happy to drive/use it, so much so that I have actually purchased this for my Daughter who is 17 after Xmas. My thinking is that I'd much rather have her driving something newer, with ABS/ESP/Airbags etc, than something 10yrs old for a similar budget. I reckon £250 will see it repaired properly, less if the PDR works.

Oh, and the cheapest Fiat 500 Lounge I could see in the trader today was £4,200, and that was a Cat C! Cheapest non-Cat was £5k...

The winning bid is in the pic, £2,500 I'll know if I'm successful within 48hrs.



If I'm not, I've already got my eye on this;


http://www.copart.co.uk/uk/Lot/23886746

Again Cat D - 64 plate, low miles. Damage has JUST missed the sill, so needs a door, wing, headlight, lower wishbone, possibly strut and grille centre. Parts come in at £250 or so, £200 for paint and it's done. That's a used door complete, new wing, headlight and susp parts.

So, if you know what you are buying, it IS possible to safely repair a vehicle, economically AND still make a profit, and yes I do declare the Cat D in my ads, and I also provide photos of the car as purchased, so people can see the extent of damage.

Hope this is useful info for those that were asking questions re Cat D & Cat C cars...

Mike

 

[Paulwirral]

I've had a few cat d vehicles and repaired a few more in my youth , go in with your eyes open and there's nothing to worry about , and there's still a bit money left in them if your that way inclined .

 

[MACK]

Its no secret money can be made from Cat c and D vehicles. A few friends of mine have been making a good living out of this for donkey's years. The age old problem with Cat D which ever way you stack it is the stigma these vehicles have, coupled to this are other factors such as many insurance companies being unwilling to insure them. All of which limiting your potential market place. The thing that sells them is their bargain price tag, after all no one in their right mind is going to pay the same money for one of them as a non cat car. Not least because you will get nothing like as much when you come to sell.

I think for many the aspect of not knowing what you are buying is also the killer. Its one thing to buy in a pre repaired state and know exactly what your getting. Its entirely another to buy a car that has been repaired and your not sure what the level of damage was.

 

[Ducklakeview]

Its no secret money can be made from Cat c and D vehicles. A few friends of mine have been making a good living out of this for donkey's years. The age old problem with Cat D which ever way you stack it is the stigma these vehicles have, coupled to this are other factors such as many insurance companies being unwilling to insure them. All of which limiting your potential market place. The thing that sells them is their bargain price tag, after all no one in their right mind is going to pay the same money for one of them as a non cat car. Not least because you will get nothing like as much when you come to sell.

I think for many the aspect of not knowing what you are buying is also the killer. Its one thing to buy in a pre repaired state and know exactly what your getting. Its entirely another to buy a car that has been repaired and your not sure what the level of damage was.

I agree, BUT there will be cars all over forecourts, including main dealers that have had the sort of damage the two I have posted above had, and if it's ended up not being recorded, as many are (no insurance, I've known people bump their car, and sell it for cash to a local dealer) who's to know what you are buying. At the end of the day, cars DO get damaged, and insurance companies DO write off perfectly repairable vehicles due to the "overall cost" of the claim, ie courtesy/hire cars, loss of use etc, and not purely down to the damage sustained to the vehicle.

Mike

 

[MACK]

Its no secret money can be made from Cat c and D vehicles. A few friends of mine have been making a good living out of this for donkey's years. The age old problem with Cat D which ever way you stack it is the stigma these vehicles have, coupled to this are other factors such as many insurance companies being unwilling to insure them. All of which limiting your potential market place. The thing that sells them is their bargain price tag, after all no one in their right mind is going to pay the same money for one of them as a non cat car. Not least because you will get nothing like as much when you come to sell.

I think for many the aspect of not knowing what you are buying is also the killer. Its one thing to buy in a pre repaired state and know exactly what your getting. Its entirely another to buy a car that has been repaired and your not sure what the level of damage was.

I agree, BUT there will be cars all over forecourts, including main dealers that have had the sort of damage the two I have posted above had, and if it's ended up not being recorded, as many are (no insurance, I've known people bump their car, and sell it for cash to a local dealer) who's to know what you are buying. At the end of the day, cars DO get damaged, and insurance companies DO write off perfectly repairable vehicles due to the "overall cost" of the claim, ie courtesy/hire cars, loss of use etc, and not purely down to the damage sustained to the vehicle.

Mike

Don't disagree last year a mate of mine that runs a indie garage with a small sales pitch tagged on, took in a BMW 320D M Sport Tourer, HPI clear car. We found a invoice tucked in the book pack for £9k worth of repairs at BMW when the car was about 2 years old with less than 20k on the clock. At the time the car couldn't have been worth much more than say £20K so if that was an insurance claim (which it may not have been) it must have been pretty close to being a write off. This was a 58 plate car. An equivalent age similar car could easily be written off for far far less today. Problem is the Cat D vehicle has the stigma and will always be worth far less in the open market than a non Cat car despite the fact the non cat car could easily have sustained far worse damage in its time.

Unfair, in this case yes but still true! The real problem with Cat C/D cars is the average buyer automatically assume the worse because they haven't seen it in its pre repair condition, images of mangled cars and cut and shuts pop into their minds!

 

[Smartbear]

I've not got an issue with people repairing these cars & selling them on, that's a fact of life.
I do have an issue with evasive, slippery sellers withholding a cars status to an unsuspecting buyer.
There's a big difference in the two camps :x
Rob

 

[MACK]

I've not got an issue with people repairing these cars & selling them on, that's a fact of life.
I do have an issue with evasive, slippery sellers withholding a cars status to an unsuspecting buyer.
There's a big difference in the two camps :x
Rob

Totally agree. Autotrader automatically flag Cat C and D cars on their site, so in one sense they are the safest of the mainstream buying mediums in the UK. That said it doesn't take a genius to work out you could get around this by using the reg number of an identical age, make and model vehicle to set up the advert. So i suppose in reality is no safer than ebay/pistonheads and the like.

That's why its always got to be worth doing a HPI check, so you know what your getting yourself into, literally!

 

[barneybear]

Hve you bought from CoPart before?
I understand there is also a hefty charge to be added once you win the auction too?

Nowt wrong with Cat D cars, its ridiculously easy thesedays with parts costs, the folk who are put off are usually ill informed, makes more potentiasl bargains for folk in the know

 

[Ducklakeview]

Hve you bought from CoPart before?
I understand there is also a hefty charge to be added once you win the auction too?

Nowt wrong with Cat D cars, its ridiculously easy thesedays with parts costs, the folk who are put off are usually ill informed, makes more potentiasl bargains for folk in the know

Similar charges to all the other auctions tbh. I am in the trade rates scale though which helps, a little.

Mike

 

[Nictrix]

I have always thought that there should be some sort of system in place where a Cat D car can be inspected after being repaired and the Cat D tag removed from the vehicle if it shows it has been repaired to an as new standard.
Just because something is deemed uneconomic to repair by a garage does not mean that someone cant fix it themselves over time on the cheap but still to a high standard.

 

[MACK]

I have always thought that there should be some sort of system in place where a Cat D car can be inspected after being repaired and the Cat D tag removed from the vehicle if it shows it has been repaired to an as new standard.
Just because something is deemed uneconomic to repair by a garage does not mean that someone cant fix it themselves over time on the cheap but still to a high standard.

I've heard this before as well but it isn't true. I wonder if this is something people have confused with old VIC inspecting the DVLA used to make you do on a repaired Cat C vehicle. However the VIC stood for Vehicle Identity Check and all they literally did was check the chassis numbers on the car in about two seconds and that was it, no inspection of repairs etc. They dont even do the VIC checks anymore as they have closed all the DVLA regional offices and stated that it was a waste of time as they only ever uncovered something like 3 ringers in 500,000 checks (something daft like that).

I do agree that particularly with Cat D vehicles they could introduce some sort of government inspection to check the quality of repairs as this would give more of the general public a level of assurance that they can safely buy these cars.

 

[MACK]

Hve you bought from CoPart before?
I understand there is also a hefty charge to be added once you win the auction too?

Nowt wrong with Cat D cars, its ridiculously easy thesedays with parts costs, the folk who are put off are usually ill informed, makes more potentiasl bargains for folk in the know

Unless of course its a zed, the high price of the parts on these and its cheaper to buy an undamaged car!

 

[Ducklakeview]

Hve you bought from CoPart before?
I understand there is also a hefty charge to be added once you win the auction too?

Nowt wrong with Cat D cars, its ridiculously easy thesedays with parts costs, the folk who are put off are usually ill informed, makes more potentiasl bargains for folk in the know

Unless of course its a zed, the high price of the parts on these and its cheaper to buy an undamaged car!

Maybe not..


https://ww2.copart.co.uk/uk/Lot/30242466?cid=

And

https://ww2.copart.co.uk/uk/Lot/30944086?cid=

Mike

 

[jampudding]

Second ones in Dubai so could be un economical to bring to the uk.

 

[MACK]

Hve you bought from CoPart before?
I understand there is also a hefty charge to be added once you win the auction too?

Nowt wrong with Cat D cars, its ridiculously easy thesedays with parts costs, the folk who are put off are usually ill informed, makes more potentiasl bargains for folk in the know

Unless of course its a zed, the high price of the parts on these and its cheaper to buy an undamaged car!

Maybe not..


https://ww2.copart.co.uk/uk/Lot/30242466?cid=

And

https://ww2.copart.co.uk/uk/Lot/30944086?cid=

Mike

 

[MACK]

Hve you bought from CoPart before?
I understand there is also a hefty charge to be added once you win the auction too?

Nowt wrong with Cat D cars, its ridiculously easy thesedays with parts costs, the folk who are put off are usually ill informed, makes more potentiasl bargains for folk in the know

Unless of course its a zed, the high price of the parts on these and its cheaper to buy an undamaged car!

Maybe not..


https://ww2.copart.co.uk/uk/Lot/30242466?cid=

And

https://ww2.copart.co.uk/uk/Lot/30944086?cid=

Mike

Yes but it will be interesting to see where they end up as they don't finish till Monday, its like any auction I suppose, all the action can happen in the last few seconds. I watched an ex fleet (think it was LEX) BMW last year on one of BCA's online only Auctions that are trade only. It went from being a very cheap car to a very expensive one in about 3 minutes at the end of the auction, so expensive it was nearly full CAP retail money and you could buy an equivalent through trader for similar money. Can be a funny thing auctions, especially when folks get carried away!

Plus most salvage auctions never mention service history etc which isn't a problem on a nearly new, very low mileage car as many wont have been serviced yet. But would be a problem on on older stuff, I wouldn't want a 56 plate car without history and it would certainly put off most buyers.

 

[paddy wright]

If a repair Is done well and honestly then there is no issue with a cat car (however I've never bought one). Seeing forum cars get written off for next to no damage these days due to age and value now, yet Lucy's old coupe will be running round with a complete front end rebuild including a chassis leg without cat status as it was damaged when it was still very new and e85/6 production was still current.
Seems unfair and was the reason when I bumped the front of mine I didn't claim as it's quick and easy to write off all our cars now they are 'old'!