Ed Doe said:
maupineda said:
Ed Doe said:
Bilsteins have internal bump stops so you shouldn't be running them externally at all!!
Who talked about running external bump stops. Is already well known B6 have the stops inside the strut housing, you need to take the insert out and then shorten the bump stop.
Until people start approaching these maters objectively and avoid marketing gimmicks, they will be sold short on their expectations.
And which crisp packet did you read that last sentence off?
Firstly the B6 are very unlikely to run on the bump stop purely as the B8 is basically the same damper but shortened. It doesn't take a genius to work out if the damper was on the bump stop there'd be no further damper travel :roll:
Secondly, how can you expect your average hobbyist to know to disassemble the damper and modify the bump stop?
And thirdly for that matter please pray tell how you increase the ride height of a fixed height damper (per your first reply to this thread)? Given the context of your reply on the bump stops I'm already imagining its 'simple - just angle grind the spring perch off and weld it back on higher up'.
you write as someone who knows, but everyday is a day at school. there is no B8 dampers for our cars (///M). And agree, it does not take a genius to figure out the car is riding on the stops, but again, as you said, the average person will not deduct this naturally, but that is the very reason these cars ride so bad with Bilstein shocks, and even more so when lowered. let me share some numbers.
- the OE dampers have ~125mm of total travel, the B6 dampers have the same amount of travel.
- the OE stops are 40mm in length
- when the car is on the ground, the shock compresses about 70mm, this leaves around 55mm of total travel; the math tells us there are only 15mm of free travel until the stop is engaged. I have no data on how much the stop can compress, but I think it can be compressed by half for another 20mm of travel until it becomes a solid block and the suspension bottoms out.
- the B6 stops are internal, and are 70mm in length
- assuming you leave the car height unaffected (stock springs), when the car is on the ground, you are now effectively seating on the stops and in fact they are already compressed some. this is offset a bit as we also know B6 make the car ride a bit higher, which is a combination of two factors, gas pressure (nitrogen filled) plus the stop, which is effectively an auxiliary spring with its own rate.
I know all of the above as I measured the suspension components and suspension travel when I got determined to make the car decent with Bilstein shocks.
That is why the B12 kit rides like shit, as you are lowering a car that already has very little bump travel by design. Bilstein had to take this approach to allow for a lower stance and provide that tautness feeling they market and sell, and yes, if the road is smooth and transitions and bumps are low speed and ample they are not too bad.
Why they designed this kit so compromised? They had to as the car when lowered looses even more travel, and to avoid the suspension bottoming so easily they need to use stiffer spring rate to limit up/down travel by having the car riding on the stop, which effectively makes the overall spring rate much higher.
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