2010 Z4 Roof Problems

[ukpolak]

Hi All,

I've had a good read around this forum and others and have a question regarding the hard top roof. I bought the Z4 car in 2011 and it was first registered in Jan 2010 so it's currently 4.5 years old.

I've never had any issues with the roof mechanism except for the other day when it came down about half way (closed -> open) and then the button went red and I had the red roof picture in the main display (i.e. cannot operate). I tried re-closing the roof and no joy, it just seemed stuck. After a couple of mins I got out of the car by ducking under the suspended roof went to check if the boot was opened and Icouldn't do anything - great as the boot was correctly locked and stopped me getting in. A couple of mins later I pressed the "open roof" button again and it opened fully, then locked. Upon arriving home the roof closed but the last 5 secs of closing (i.e. the boot section lowering) seemed to take longer than previously.

A summary of my related issues over the past couple of days since the above episode.

Roof Open Problem
Anyway in every occasion since, I get a similar issue:
- I press the button to open roof; it opens all the way after the windows open successsfully.
- last few secs before window goes up, seems to take longer than usual. I hear a whirring in the boot with no obvious evidence of any movement. Sometimes the red light flashes even though I think it's locked. SOmetimes the red light just disappears as if it is locked (but the car didn't think so).
- On one occasion, I thought the roof was fully open but the red light was flashing. I turned the car off, waited 5secs, then turned on again and no red light (as if the opening roof operation had been successful). Maybe a sensor incorrectly thinking the roof is down when it isn't, or the mechanism has not completed when it has?

Roof Incorrectly Showing as Not Secured
Today I did a 50mile drive with a suit-case in the boot and roof closed. Upon slowing down when arriving at the destination, all of a sudden a the "dong" sound started and I had the red=roof pic in my dash, as if the roof was in mid-position or had failed. After a minute or so, the noise / light disappeared. I was doing 50mph and there was no way that the roof was part open, and note that alarm started towards the end of a long-ish journey and then disappeared after a few secs (sensor issue??).

Unable to Open Boot this Morning
Before the 50mile drive (above), I tried opening the boot with my remote and also with the round BMW button on the boot and for the first 10 or so goes it just didn't work. I tried a number of times before thinking I may not be able to access it, then one final time and it worked. Have tested opening the boot with both key and BMW button a few times since, and no issue.


These issues only started a couple of days ago.. last week I karcher washed the car so I don't know if this is relevant? I've seen guides where the motor sits in a Z4 sump which can fill with water, and people recommend draining this sump as it fills with cr@p and then soaks the motor, but this appears to be related to older cloth top Z4s rather than my hard-top (??).

Also the motor seems fine as it always makes a normal noise. I had thought it may be a motor issue but given that the car thought that the roof was mid-open on the journey today, it would appear that there is a sensor incorrectly giving a signal to the car? I don't know if this will explain the boot not opening up - unless the car didn't think it was safe to open the boot so didn't let me (??).

Any thoughts welcome - great forum and a great car I just hope this is easy and cheap to fix!

Thanks.

 

[TitanTim]

One or two have had similar whereby the roof won't complete its action or does so in a haphazard or intermittant way. I think in most cases it will be a faulty microswitch thats on its way out, there are few of these that monitor roof positions. Unsure what the cost would be to fix outside of warranty but it won't be one thing I will miss on the E89, too much complication as the cars age. Its much easier on my Z3, undo two latches and push the hood down and alot faster lol

Tim.

 

[ukpolak]

Thanks Tim.

Last night and this morning I went through a few full cycles and no issues whatsoever, very bizzare.

I'm giving a dealer a call today to get some advice as fingers crossed it's just a faulty / misaligned sensor as I doubt the motor mechanism has failed.

 

[flybobbie]

My business partner has the same problems. Been going bong since the weather warmed up a bit, which might suggest some kind of expansion causing a faulty switch to trigger a fault. In fact never been right since she bought the car.
Went to BMW last week after getting stuck at the point the boot should close, then would stop on closure when roof panel six inches from the windshield.
Her car was supposedly fixed last week, yet it still bongs and the roof speed is too fast, the top panel crashing hard into the top of the window frame.
The rear deck boot pushes hard towards the roll hoops and the motor doesn't stop until you take your finger off remote button.
Going in again Tuesday.

I want to know what the fix is in case I have problems with my car out of warranty.

 

[ukpolak]

Interesting - thankfully mine does not suffer from a too-keen motor overexerting, it's more a case of it stopping mid-operation because of an erroneous sensor signal.

Today is a lot cooler than it has been the past few days so perhaps the expansion thing is relevant.. since the weather has been nicer, my folding wing-mirrors make lots more noise when they retract (purely a temperature / heat thing) so perhaps the heat is having an effect on the roof too.

On occasions I have filled out the boot both with the roof closed, and with the roof down, and I also wonder if packing the boot too much may put pressure on some of these sensors / panels where the sensors sit, thus causing the misalignment if I drive over a pot-hole etc.

 

[Baza]

I also have a problem on my 2009 E89 > I can open the roof but have problems closing. When initiated via the switch/button the boot lid opens and the roof with the back window section moves into the correct position and locates to the top of the windscreen ,the boot closes but the rear window section will not move from the top of the roof,like others I can hear a motor whirring away but no movement. So its into the dealer but have to wait nearly two weeks to get it in,typical when it's hood down driving weather.

Suspect a map setting,will advise in due course

 

[flybobbie]

Sounds like its not detecting boot closed and motor still running waiting for command to close rear window.
Be nice to know when peps get cars fixed, what the fix was for future reference.

Bus. partners car went in Tuesday, they said it was fixed Friday, but not returned :roll:

 

[ukpolak]

Thanks for your inputs guys.

I've lived with the problem for the past week or so...

- On one occasion again with the roof closed and the rear parcel shelf up, during a long-ish journey I had a 5sec warning that the roof was not correctly latched! Disappeared soon after.
- Again once I couldn't open the boot (with the roof closed) both by pressing key fob and the rounnd BMW logo on the boot. Upon me looking inside the car I noticed one of the roof open/close buttons was flashing so this is the root-cause of this problem
- Now, whenever I try to open the roof from closed, it'll go through the motions but never quite close to the point that the windows go back up. The last boot lowering action takes a bit of time and either ends with an alarm or all ok (albeit no windows returning). So I then monentarily close the roof again, then re-press the open-roof button and it seems to close fine and windows go back up.

Does indeed sound like one of the sensors which detects boot-closed is not functioning correctly.. at least i've been able to narrow it down to that.

Car is going in to an independent BMW specialist today and they've said that they have seen similar issues in the past and can diagnose individual sensor issues and replace the faults, so fingers crossed it gets sorted. Will advise in a couple of days - fingers crossed!!

Still no idea what caused the issue originally but I did pressure wash the car a few days before the first sign of a problem (??) and similarly i have travelled with a packed boot a few times, so perhaps something inside was rubbing up against one of the sensors and dislodged etc.

Will advise soon..!

 

[Baza]

Any feedback yet on if the problem was resolved and what it was, would be interested to hear

 

[ukpolak]

Yes... I took it to an independent bmw specialist here on the south coast a few days ago.

They ran a diagnostic which returned a small problem with one sensor, which they realigned slightly. The diagnostic also returned an error on the control module but this was intermittent and so they couldn't accurately conclude what the problem was.

I was charged £50 for the diagnostic check and hoped the minor fiddling with one sensor would sort it. They didn't seem to convincing during the whole procedure so my guess is they don't really know much about roof operation other than how to replace a motor or other more mechanical / easy to diagnose problems.

Since I got the car back again I've had issues but I can work around all of them:
- Boot didn't open from locked-car yesterday for a minute. So i opened car, turned on engine, waited for roof-operation fault to clear, then boot was open-able again.
- Roof never fully opens or fully closes - Gets 90% done but the "close boot" portion always takes time to start. Solution is to take finger off of button, wait a couple of secs, then re-press and the process completes without issue.
- Yesterday (with roof down) i had a 2 sec warning during a journey that roof wasn't correctly latched - of course no way to fix this but thankfully it disappeared just as soon as it started.

I can live with the roof operation work around and the odd "dong" during a journey, however the boot not opening is a bit more worrying as i regularly put stuff in, and don't want to ever be stuck not being able to open it.

So... am booking in to local BMW dealerships to try to sort. They can't see me for 2 weeks and will charge max £100 to diagnose the fault before telling me what to do to fix. Thankfully I have the diagnosis from the independent place and know the ins/outs of the problem very well, so that should assist in them finding the root-cause and sorting it once and for all.

My only niggle is that I think the car is worth £14,000 (4.5yrs old, 40k miles, immaculate inside/out) and it's looking like this will prob cost in the order of £700 to fix (which is what a new roof control unit + labour costs).

 

[Baza]

Thanks for the info looks like your problems continue.I was going to my local dealer to sort out my problems,but I came across a company in Dorking who specialise on roof problems on BMW and other German makes. The owner was trained by BMW and it looks like they sound a better bet. They charge £60.00 for the diagnostic check and then give a fixed price for the work. I will be taking the Z4 to them in just over a couple of weeks will inform when completed.

 

[InvisibleName]

My only niggle is that I think the car is worth £14,000 (4.5yrs old, 40k miles, immaculate inside/out) and it's looking like this will prob cost in the order of £700 to fix (which is what a new roof control unit + labour costs).

And that is why I've been paying for an extended warranty on my car - the cost of some of the major components is crazy money!

 

[ukpolak]

Thanks for your responses guys.

Given my history with this issue and the fact that it's reasonably repeatable, plus the diagnosis from the independent dealer, I'm hoping that I can walk/talk BMW through the problem so that it doesn't take them the whole hour to diagnose the fault!

In the event that they diagnose accurately but charge something crazy to fix, I'll definitely look elsewhere to fix so please update on other experiences. Unfortunately for things in any way out of the ordinary you really need to either go to an official dealer or visit an independent who specialises in "fancy" things like retractable hard-tops etc.

I've read on other forums that sometimes the cables between the sensors / roof-control-unit / hydraulic motor can be pinched if moved slightly, thereby impairing connections and also leading to an intermittent fault. So root cause is far from identified just yet - will keep you posted.

 

[flybobbie]

My colleague had her car back today, fixed.
It works but I think its still not right. The rear deck/boot pushes too far forward when it closes.
If I can talk her into it, i will go to dealer, show them and try to find out how they fixed her car.
She has totally fallen out of love with car.

 

[ronk]

------ two latches and push the hood down and alot faster lol .

Most thing things have become more complicated tho!
If we didn't progress we would still be driving in ox carts and the women would be washing our shirts on flat stones by the river!

Oh and you would have had to meet in a smokey ale house to discuss our transport choices not sitting in the armchair with a laptop etc.

No, give me progress every time.

Modern design and manufacturing methods have ensured that devices are much more reliable now. Ie an engine was ready for a rebuild at 40k not that many years ago!

 

[ukpolak]

OK update as follows...

- Last week no noticable issue and had roof down / up a few times during the nice weather. No probs opening boot, no "warning" signal when driving and smoothe open/close.

So.. I cancelled service at dealership as don't want them to try to identify a fault which is so intermittent and infrequent...

Just my luck, yesterday evening when driving I had the "dong" alarm for a moment indicating insecure roof. It disappeared just as soon as it started and same again this morning. This morning the roof kind of stopped in mid-close, then I took finger off of button and re-pressed, and it continued.

So... the fault is so intermittent and thankfully the biggest problem (not being able to open boot) hasn't occured for a fortnight. I'm sure BMW will have problems accurately diagnosing the fault on such an intermittent problem, and I don't want them changing something unless they're 100% sure what the problem is. If the problem recurs more frequently or gets more severe (boot not opening, roof actually won't work at all, alarm constantly dong-ing during journey) then sure I'll have it seen to but it seems like such an infrequent annoyance at the moment that I don't want them looking at it, if they can't see the problem first hand.

Will keep you all posted with progress...

 

[jwa1]

I had the same issue. It just gets worse until it gongs at you all the time and you end up getting stuck with your roof down or half up, windows down, boot locked. It's an easy fix and they should be able to detect an open circuit. I would book it in if I were you.

 

[Baza]

As reported earlier I also had the same problems on My 2009 E89 i.e. roof would not finish closing it would stop at the position when the final section this being the rear window section should move from above the roof and close onto the boot lid. Also when the roof was closed (after some repeated trying on the up/down buttons) the warning gong would continually sound when driving and the warning roof light would show on the dash,any pressing of buttons at this stage would result in all the windows going down and the boot locking. Only by waiting some hours with the engine off did the opening button light stop flashing and I could then open the boot with key fob, and could put the windows up)

Today I went to an independent ex BMW guy who specialises in roof and hood problems. the diagnostics pointed to a micro switch ( sensor) which should be activated when the boot lid closes during the roof down sequence. Mine was faulty and only worked intermittently ,a new switch was obtained from a local BMW dealer and fitted, hey presto it all functions again. Long may it continue.

For me worth the 4 hour round trip.

 

[flybobbie]

Would you know the exact location of the switch?

 

[Baza]

Sorry didn't get into that much detail