Clutch pedal bump stop

[Meds]

I am another one in the camp of; surely you learn your car’s characteristics and only push the pedal as far as needed?

Totally agree. Every car is different and you get used to the idiosyncrasies (if they exist) and drive accordingly. I have an old 1970 911S - change slowly, 88 205 Pug GTi again slow. My BMW 1M and E86M are modern by comparison and can be changed as fast or as slowly as required.

TBH, I have no idea why there are so many posts complaining about the gear change in our E86/86 M cars…I love it.

I have zero complaints about the change, feel, or speed. None, at all.
It's the long throw of dead travel at the end of the clutch. Past the bite point.

For us shorties, it's uncomfortable. (and this has been the case for me in many other cars of various brands)

[coldel]

Yep thats the point Meds...and as I am not a driving god like some, and dont drive the car enough to forge a mental relationship with the clutch, that I found the £10 solution perfect. I mean why wouldnt you fix that issue for the sake of a tenner, its a no brainer

[enuff_zed]

as I am not a driving god like some,

Really?!
No need to take a swing at people just because they drive differently to you.

[coldel]

as I am not a driving god like some,

Really?!
No need to take a swing at people just because they drive differently to you.

Who took the first swing though?!

[Meds]

Putting aside who's a driving god, or not.

I'm very intruiged, though.
How you guys operate the clutch without utilising the bulkhead stopper.?
Do you disengage the clutch and then hold the pedal in the dead space between disengagement and the bulkhead?

I disengage the clutch and push through to the bulkhead stopper, the pedal lands there, and it doesnt get lifted off the stopper until I need to engage the clutch again.

All my driving years, I've had issues with 'long' clutch pedals. I own a 29" (30" on a good day) inside leg with slightly longer than normal arms.
Resulting in my clutch leg at near full extension, this is not comfy, but I put up with it.
I dont own calf muscles like tree trunks so operating the clutch by flexing my ankle is not possible.

I tried one of these clutch stops bumper thingys years back and it was a revelation. No more awkward knee clunking or twisting my hips to compensate.

Let me clarify, again. This has nothing to do with speed of shifting or trying to improve feel, bite point, gear change or anything else.

[smorris_12]

FWIW, in this situation, it's easier on the musculature to have a defined end stop as, once reached, the body will relax the muscles slightly. Holding something in a fixed position without a reference point causes the muscles to be working, if only slightly, harder.

[coldel]

Putting aside who's a driving god, or not.

I'm very intruiged, though.
How you guys operate the clutch without utilising the bulkhead stopper.?
Do you disengage the clutch and then hold the pedal in the dead space between disengagement and the bulkhead?

I disengage the clutch and push through to the bulkhead stopper, the pedal lands there, and it doesnt get lifted off the stopper until I need to engage the clutch again.

All my driving years, I've had issues with 'long' clutch pedals. I own a 29" (30" on a good day) inside leg with slightly longer than normal arms.
Resulting in my clutch leg at near full extension, this is not comfy, but I put up with it.
I dont own calf muscles like tree trunks so operating the clutch by flexing my ankle is not possible.

I tried one of these clutch stops bumper thingys years back and it was a revelation. No more awkward knee clunking or twisting my hips to compensate.

Let me clarify, again. This has nothing to do with speed of shifting or trying to improve feel, bite point, gear change or anything else.

Yes thats the issue, I am not trying to drive fast or race and I have owned more cars than I can realistically remember all with their own characteristics but its not about that, I just want to drive normally like almost everyone else takes for granted. I did like the steering wheel reach adjustment on my old 350z as that helped but no such functionality on many other cars I've owned that moved it as much as that did.

I think its something that generally doesn't affect the majority of people that have an average proportioned body, but for us 'half short half long' uns its no fun at all

[Meds]

FWIW, in this situation, it's easier on the musculature to have a defined end stop as, once reached, the body will relax the muscles slightly. Holding something in a fixed position without a reference point causes the muscles to be working, if only slightly, harder.

Yes, exactly.
I find, pressing the clutch down against the stop is easier and more accurate than holding it thin air, against pressure pulling it back at you.
I dont know how folk can drive like this, and I always thought nobody did, until this conversation.
Have I been driving wrong for 25 years ?

I'm interested and might head out later to see if I can get my legs to learn some new muscle memory and give it a go.

Can the guys who dont use the end stop, clarify this? You dont ever push the clutch back till the hard stop?

What are these about?

You push the pedal far enough to make it work even if others may push it further, but with no actual benefit.

I am another one in the camp of; surely you learn your car’s characteristics and only push the pedal as far as needed?

[enuff_zed]

as I am not a driving god like some,

Really?!
No need to take a swing at people just because they drive differently to you.

Who took the first swing though?!

Dunno? Not me as I was merely stating a fact in the hope it would give the OP another option to consider.
I can't even spell oGd.

[mmm-five]

I'm sure we've had this very same discussion years ago on this very site, so will not try to argue for one option over the other, as it's personal preference.

Yes, exactly.
I find, pressing the clutch down against the stop is easier and more accurate than holding it thin air, against pressure pulling it back at you.
I dont know how folk can drive like this, and I always thought nobody did, until this conversation.
Have I been driving wrong for 25 years ?

I'm interested and might head out later to see if I can get my legs to learn some new muscle memory and give it a go.

Surely the pressure on your leg is the same whether it's half-pressed or fully-pressed? Maybe more if fully-pressed as the spring will be at it's full length?

Can the guys who dont use the end stop, clarify this? You dont ever push the clutch back till the hard stop?

The only time I've ever hit the clutch stop (in this car or my e34 M5s) is when my clutch has gone - just to make sure it's not just gone 'long'.

I'm not sure there's even an argument that it's bad for the clutch, as the last 2 clutches have been at over 100,000 miles (one in the Z4MC a 140k and one on the 3.8 M5 at 110k)...and both did track days and Ring trips.

[Meds]

I think the act of fully depressing (to the stop) eliminates any guesswork of where the pedal is in relation to the clutch.
When it's hard down on the stop, it's disengaged, no question.
Regardless, if more or less effort is needed to press the pedal.

I need to head out and try to change my habit (of a lifetime) to NOT fully depress the clutch pedal to the hard stop.

I'm thinking out loud here:
If I'm holding the peddle in the 'dead area' during the time it takes me to physically shift gear. Could a large undulation/bump/change in direction result in my foot/leg angle being altered, during the time it's taken me to shift the gear.
The result is the peddle moving while shifting = bad things happen.
Pressing the peddle to stop, eliminates this.

The act of pressing against the stop during the shift, removes this risk of the clutch engaging, mid-shift. Does it not?

But like I say, I need to head out and try it.

[futureZ4buyer]

So if I understood correctly, some people are switching gears without pushing the clutch fully?
Just asking because I've never heard of that.

[Meds]

So if I understood correctly, some people are switching gears without pushing the clutch fully?
Just asking because I've never heard of that.

Yes, seems so.
Some are 'floating' the pedal in thin air while changing or maneuvering with the clutch.
I guess this also means they have the pedal floating while starting the engine, rather than against the stop. Sounds bonkers to me.

I've tried this recently and find it inaccurate and I feel there's a high risk of crunching gears if your foot moves between shifts. Using the bump stop eliminates this risk.

I don't have confidence in the pedal if I cannot start its travel from the bulkhead hard stop.

At least with the pedal at full travel, on the bump stop, there's no risk, the clutch is disengaged when on the stop.

Maybe I'm still doing it wrong, but after 25years of driving like this and trying recently to change the habit, it's not happening.
I've tried many times since this conversation started.

I guess there's 2 different ways to use the clutch, based on what people have described.
1. Use the pedal bump stop on each press.
2. Float the pedal between the bite point and bump stop.

I'm firmly in option 1, despite trying option 2 a few times recently as I'm always open to new ideas.

Back on topic, though.
My home-made bump stop is perfect, my short ass stumpy legs are now not over extending to press the clutch to the stop. The 25mm less travel makes all the difference.
No more twisting hips or clicky knee joints.

[enuff_zed]

So if I understood correctly, some people are switching gears without pushing the clutch fully?
Just asking because I've never heard of that.

The disengagement point of the clutch is well before the pedal bottoms out.
Remember being taught to drive? Let the pedal come up until you feel the clutch bite. That is the point where the clutch disengages on the way down.

[Mr Tidy]

I just use the full travel when I depress the clutch pedal as I assume BMW gave it that amount of travel for a reason!

I pretty much have to in my 330i anyway or it won't start.