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More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
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OnlineB21
- Lifer
- Posts: 5450
- Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:15 pm
- Location: In my Banana Yellow Space Shuttle...somewhere over Southern Caledonia
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
So if you want to know in detail what spending over £7k on bigger turbos, bigger exhaust system, bigger inlets, outlets, bigger intercooler, better ignition syste and better LPFP gives you then its about 150 BHP more than a stock 35is and 180nm torque..or put it another way £500 gets you the first 60 BHP and the next 90 BHP costs £6k+..you can all now leave..
For those that stayed..
So my tame tuner Richard aka carabuser on certain forums has with me iterated slowly through 6 revisions of tune..we are now at 20.5 PSI boost on 99 RON fuel, running very sweetly.
Took the car to the dyno guys today (Met with Nanu there)..and we did three sets of runs on V4 (As its called) of Richard's tune..with stock airbox and filter, with a Pipercross foam filter and with the airbox lid off..ie fresh air into the inlets..
The dyno results are on the graph shown, and for reference included the old MHD V10 stage 2+ maps with its best figure (lid off).
So its a 500 bhp 700nm torque engine now (there's is a liitle more tweaking to be done, but we are really as far as this is going to go..that is reliably, forever and with absolutely fabulous driving ability..
The price of discovery is usually high..no regrets..but I think tuning wise, subject to fine details we are done..
Enjoy..
https://youtu.be/o88ldXzhpe4
For those that stayed..
So my tame tuner Richard aka carabuser on certain forums has with me iterated slowly through 6 revisions of tune..we are now at 20.5 PSI boost on 99 RON fuel, running very sweetly.
Took the car to the dyno guys today (Met with Nanu there)..and we did three sets of runs on V4 (As its called) of Richard's tune..with stock airbox and filter, with a Pipercross foam filter and with the airbox lid off..ie fresh air into the inlets..
The dyno results are on the graph shown, and for reference included the old MHD V10 stage 2+ maps with its best figure (lid off).
So its a 500 bhp 700nm torque engine now (there's is a liitle more tweaking to be done, but we are really as far as this is going to go..that is reliably, forever and with absolutely fabulous driving ability..
The price of discovery is usually high..no regrets..but I think tuning wise, subject to fine details we are done..
Enjoy..
https://youtu.be/o88ldXzhpe4
- Attachments
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- IMG_7773.jpg (262.38 KiB) Viewed 784 times
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- IMG_7774.jpg (171.65 KiB) Viewed 784 times
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- TTE 500 turbos run May 2023 V4 tune.jpg (129.66 KiB) Viewed 784 times
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- stock vs mhd stage 2+ v10 no airbox or filter subtract 8 bhp and 5 nm for airbox and filter.jpg (82.49 KiB) Viewed 784 times
We choose to go to on with this endeavour at this time and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard…
A very modified Atacama Yellow 35is
A very modified Atacama Yellow 35is
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- Lifer
- Posts: 8503
- Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2021 7:20 pm
- Location: Spaldingski
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
Are you posting this multiple times to make sure no-one has a chance to miss it?
Kind of understandable when you've spent that kind of dosh to impress, I suppose!
Kind of understandable when you've spent that kind of dosh to impress, I suppose!
All good things come to those who wait. I'm really impatient which explains a lot.
F31 320i. Good car.
E89 20i Now fully dried
Z3 'free litre'. Project and a half. Complicated!
Mazda3 sold
Tatty old R56 Mini Cooper. Money pit!
F31 320i. Good car.
E89 20i Now fully dried
Z3 'free litre'. Project and a half. Complicated!
Mazda3 sold
Tatty old R56 Mini Cooper. Money pit!
-
OnlineB21
- Lifer
- Posts: 5450
- Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:15 pm
- Location: In my Banana Yellow Space Shuttle...somewhere over Southern Caledonia
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
I publish specific work packages individually so that anyone looking at that specific subject can look at it in isolation…I add the work to the long running story for continuity and for those who want to see how the story unfolds over time
I realise it’s rich in content and light on opinion…
I realise it’s rich in content and light on opinion…
We choose to go to on with this endeavour at this time and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard…
A very modified Atacama Yellow 35is
A very modified Atacama Yellow 35is
- smorris_12
- Member
- Posts: 902
- Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:14 pm
- Location: Somerset
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
I actually like fresh threads for new bits of a project. I have a tendency to skip threads eventually when they become a long list of (well warranted) "well done"s and miss the actual updates.
Nice to see the gains vs cost. Be interested to know the difference in fuel economy in the day to day pottering to the shops etc.
(Oh, and keep up the good work with the thread titles!)
Nice to see the gains vs cost. Be interested to know the difference in fuel economy in the day to day pottering to the shops etc.
(Oh, and keep up the good work with the thread titles!)
------
Scott
Where are we going and why am I in this handbasket?
2006 Z4 2.5si Silbergrau und rot
Scott
Where are we going and why am I in this handbasket?
2006 Z4 2.5si Silbergrau und rot
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- Senior Member
- Posts: 2811
- Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2016 2:49 am
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OnlineB21
- Lifer
- Posts: 5450
- Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:15 pm
- Location: In my Banana Yellow Space Shuttle...somewhere over Southern Caledonia
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
Very well indeed (now) but probably not when 500 BHP is applied..call me conservative and cautious..
We choose to go to on with this endeavour at this time and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard…
A very modified Atacama Yellow 35is
A very modified Atacama Yellow 35is
- buzyg
- Legend
- Posts: 26532
- Joined: Fri May 20, 2011 6:11 pm
- Location: Cornwall
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OnlineB21
- Lifer
- Posts: 5450
- Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:15 pm
- Location: In my Banana Yellow Space Shuttle...somewhere over Southern Caledonia
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
For those interested in how tuning is done …the car is put into manual 3rd gear and rolling at less than 2,000 rpm..it’s then booted at full throttle to the shift point, after the shift the run finishes..the MHD data logging strips out the before and after and gives a window with upto 80 variables that are recorded which then can be analysed after …
Afterwards the logs can be viewed within MHD or a custom viewer in this case Spoolstreet..
I’m showing todays logging which is the 8 th iteration of tune..the strategy to be safe and slowly increment variables to see how the engine responds…every engine is unique albeit with some common traits ..eg on the N54 normally cylinders 5 and 6 are more problematic as the gas flow to them is poorer and the back of the engine is hotter..
I’ve used the reader bar to show some data values…
You can’t graph all variables at one time as the scales get compressed and there’s too much clutter.
So there are several to show different attributes..
I todays run on a different road and I can see the rpm line is not as smooth previous ones as the car was riding less smoothly..
We can see on one chart rpm, called for boost pressure and actual boost pressure..this is a good graph as the real boost pressure is pretty closely tracking the called for once we are underway….at the beginning we have the lag effect of what’s called for and what’s available falls short.
We have a graph showing high pressure fuel flow ..this is a mechanical pump with no speed control ..the good news is we above 1,500 psi all the time we need it..running low could result in melted pistons…
We have a graph showing ignition deviation per cylinder from the planned timing...corrections are common and there’s a trade off between not enough power and too many corrections..note the odd rogue one..
Another graph shows waste gate duty cycle ..100% is waste gate fully closed ..this should only occur when initial boost production…a good rule of thumb is to be at 50% ish when going full chat..showing your turbos are working too hard..
The air intake temperature graph is a function of how good your intercooler is, how hard your turbos are working and how cool the air coming into the intakes are..
In this case we have excellent control…bearing in mind this is in F and we can get upto 300c air temps leaving the turbos if it’s all going bad..
Enjoy..
Afterwards the logs can be viewed within MHD or a custom viewer in this case Spoolstreet..
I’m showing todays logging which is the 8 th iteration of tune..the strategy to be safe and slowly increment variables to see how the engine responds…every engine is unique albeit with some common traits ..eg on the N54 normally cylinders 5 and 6 are more problematic as the gas flow to them is poorer and the back of the engine is hotter..
I’ve used the reader bar to show some data values…
You can’t graph all variables at one time as the scales get compressed and there’s too much clutter.
So there are several to show different attributes..
I todays run on a different road and I can see the rpm line is not as smooth previous ones as the car was riding less smoothly..
We can see on one chart rpm, called for boost pressure and actual boost pressure..this is a good graph as the real boost pressure is pretty closely tracking the called for once we are underway….at the beginning we have the lag effect of what’s called for and what’s available falls short.
We have a graph showing high pressure fuel flow ..this is a mechanical pump with no speed control ..the good news is we above 1,500 psi all the time we need it..running low could result in melted pistons…
We have a graph showing ignition deviation per cylinder from the planned timing...corrections are common and there’s a trade off between not enough power and too many corrections..note the odd rogue one..
Another graph shows waste gate duty cycle ..100% is waste gate fully closed ..this should only occur when initial boost production…a good rule of thumb is to be at 50% ish when going full chat..showing your turbos are working too hard..
The air intake temperature graph is a function of how good your intercooler is, how hard your turbos are working and how cool the air coming into the intakes are..
In this case we have excellent control…bearing in mind this is in F and we can get upto 300c air temps leaving the turbos if it’s all going bad..
Enjoy..
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- IMG_1862.jpeg (60.33 KiB) Viewed 636 times
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- IMG_1864.jpeg (61.67 KiB) Viewed 636 times
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- IMG_1865.jpeg (58.23 KiB) Viewed 636 times
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- IMG_1866.jpeg (59.17 KiB) Viewed 636 times
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- IMG_1867.jpeg (55.74 KiB) Viewed 636 times
We choose to go to on with this endeavour at this time and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard…
A very modified Atacama Yellow 35is
A very modified Atacama Yellow 35is
-
OnlineB21
- Lifer
- Posts: 5450
- Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:15 pm
- Location: In my Banana Yellow Space Shuttle...somewhere over Southern Caledonia
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
It just keeps going…previously it was obvious after 5.5k that you were chasing a declining benefit..you can see that on the MHD10 plots..now it keeps on singing..so much that I’ve moved the 3rd 4th gear shifts to 7k..
It’s really really lovely..
The re-mapped gearbox..xHP..with these turbos and the much developed tunes have had great results..
Much smoother..much revier ..well pleased..
We choose to go to on with this endeavour at this time and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard…
A very modified Atacama Yellow 35is
A very modified Atacama Yellow 35is
- buzyg
- Legend
- Posts: 26532
- Joined: Fri May 20, 2011 6:11 pm
- Location: Cornwall
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
Enjoy.B21 wrote: ↑Wed May 31, 2023 6:10 pmIt just keeps going…previously it was obvious after 5.5k that you were chasing a declining benefit..you can see that on the MHD10 plots..now it keeps on singing..so much that I’ve moved the 3rd 4th gear shifts to 7k..
It’s really really lovely..
The re-mapped gearbox..xHP..with these turbos and the much developed tunes have had great results..
Much smoother..much revier ..well pleased..
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- Lifer
- Posts: 11077
- Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2015 10:27 pm
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
.......for the short period it's not facing the wrong way up a big Oak tree.......buzyg wrote: ↑Wed May 31, 2023 6:38 pmEnjoy.B21 wrote: ↑Wed May 31, 2023 6:10 pmIt just keeps going…previously it was obvious after 5.5k that you were chasing a declining benefit..you can see that on the MHD10 plots..now it keeps on singing..so much that I’ve moved the 3rd 4th gear shifts to 7k..
It’s really really lovely..
The re-mapped gearbox..xHP..with these turbos and the much developed tunes have had great results..
Much smoother..much revier ..well pleased..
M roady...OEM CSL’s, strut brace, Remus back boxes, ZHP
MR2 MK 2
E89 35i project car...mapped 365bhp, M4 stoppers & wheels, KWV3’s, H&R front ARB, M3 front arms, strut brace Eisenmann cat back race exhaust, VRSF downpipes inbound
E89 35is
G29
MR2 MK 2
E89 35i project car...mapped 365bhp, M4 stoppers & wheels, KWV3’s, H&R front ARB, M3 front arms, strut brace Eisenmann cat back race exhaust, VRSF downpipes inbound
E89 35is
G29
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- Lifer
- Posts: 8503
- Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2021 7:20 pm
- Location: Spaldingski
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
Now that was uncalled for Johnathan!
Peter lives in Scotland, so more likely to be a Pine tree..........a pine in the arse as it were.
All good things come to those who wait. I'm really impatient which explains a lot.
F31 320i. Good car.
E89 20i Now fully dried
Z3 'free litre'. Project and a half. Complicated!
Mazda3 sold
Tatty old R56 Mini Cooper. Money pit!
F31 320i. Good car.
E89 20i Now fully dried
Z3 'free litre'. Project and a half. Complicated!
Mazda3 sold
Tatty old R56 Mini Cooper. Money pit!
-
- Lifer
- Posts: 11077
- Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2015 10:27 pm
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
I'm not sure he'll have much arse left once it's cartwheeled around the estate.....
M roady...OEM CSL’s, strut brace, Remus back boxes, ZHP
MR2 MK 2
E89 35i project car...mapped 365bhp, M4 stoppers & wheels, KWV3’s, H&R front ARB, M3 front arms, strut brace Eisenmann cat back race exhaust, VRSF downpipes inbound
E89 35is
G29
MR2 MK 2
E89 35i project car...mapped 365bhp, M4 stoppers & wheels, KWV3’s, H&R front ARB, M3 front arms, strut brace Eisenmann cat back race exhaust, VRSF downpipes inbound
E89 35is
G29
-
- Lifer
- Posts: 8503
- Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2021 7:20 pm
- Location: Spaldingski
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
Peter will tell you off for being silly in the wrong place. The Lounge is the place for that, not serious threads like this one.
Sorry Peter!
All good things come to those who wait. I'm really impatient which explains a lot.
F31 320i. Good car.
E89 20i Now fully dried
Z3 'free litre'. Project and a half. Complicated!
Mazda3 sold
Tatty old R56 Mini Cooper. Money pit!
F31 320i. Good car.
E89 20i Now fully dried
Z3 'free litre'. Project and a half. Complicated!
Mazda3 sold
Tatty old R56 Mini Cooper. Money pit!
-
- Lifer
- Posts: 11077
- Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2015 10:27 pm
More boost Mr Sulu, the results are in..
M roady...OEM CSL’s, strut brace, Remus back boxes, ZHP
MR2 MK 2
E89 35i project car...mapped 365bhp, M4 stoppers & wheels, KWV3’s, H&R front ARB, M3 front arms, strut brace Eisenmann cat back race exhaust, VRSF downpipes inbound
E89 35is
G29
MR2 MK 2
E89 35i project car...mapped 365bhp, M4 stoppers & wheels, KWV3’s, H&R front ARB, M3 front arms, strut brace Eisenmann cat back race exhaust, VRSF downpipes inbound
E89 35is
G29