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Car sim card, API connection to BMW Company servers and privacy

Discussing the current generation Z4
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Car sim card, API connection to BMW Company servers and privacy

Post by BMW_User » Fri Jan 27, 2023 3:45 pm

Hi everyone,

I would like to share some concerns about the way modern cars, including our Z4, are constantly connected to the car maker servers.
Pretty much all new cars have a sim card used for:
  • Sat nav and traffic information
  • Emergency breakdown assistance
  • Remote checks
BMW and many other car makers have started introducing permanent connections to their servers exposing some services that the car can access over the Internet (the set of services is called usually API, technically).
Modern cars have a sim card which the majority of the customers are not aware of, a microphone in the car for voice activated functions and remote assistance as a premium package.
In a nutshell, when we use our cars, the car maker can know everything that is happening in the car: speed, location and also potentially what we say in the car.

This to me is already disturbing enough and, if the car maker can have all this information, so can the Government should they want to legally force car makers to handle all this data for national security reasons or what not.
All the above has already happened for other sectors so I'm not discussing whether it's possible, legal or probable. If it can be done, it will be done.

My car dealer told me many times that when taking a new car for personal use, he and his colleagues switch off all the advanced features as they don't trust and don't approve this invasion of privacy.
The problem is that they cannot switch everything off, for example the sim card connection, unless you go fiddle with the wiring and/or hack the software.

Car makers seem to justify this by telling customers that they want to help drivers, forgetting that if you cannot drive a car properly without assistance of any sort, you should probably not have a driving license in the first place.
The reality is that this data is part of big data collected from other sources and it is used for real-time analysis of cars, traffic, routes, habits, and so on at the sole benefits of car makers and ultimately the Government.

Recently, an official communication from some Governments said that the new cars will have to have a black box and a kill switch to be used from the Law Enforcement.
Apart from the dangers of switching off the car remotely when the car is moving on the road and performing actions like overtaking, avoiding obstacles or else, the implementation sounds like a nanny state that considers you a 5 year old child incapable of having individual freedom and judgement, and wants to tell you when you can use the car, where you can use the car and at what conditions.

I am hoping people can see the shift towards a more and more centralized form of control in all aspects of our society, but sticking to the subject of cars that I have described above, has any of you thought about these problems and is anyone talking about this in the industry?
Are there associations of car drivers or car enthusiasts that are trying to put pressure on the Governments on this matter?

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Car sim card, API connection to BMW Company servers and privacy

Post by Scubaregs » Fri Jan 27, 2023 5:37 pm

Buy a deaf horse.
Abstinence is fine, in moderation.

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Car sim card, API connection to BMW Company servers and privacy

Post by BMW_User » Fri Jan 27, 2023 7:14 pm

Is that a way to say that you know nothing about it or have you been living in a cave for 20 years?

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Post by Scubaregs » Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:46 pm

It's a way of saying there are far more important things in life to worry about. If it bothers you that much, sell the car.
Abstinence is fine, in moderation.

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Nanu
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Car sim card, API connection to BMW Company servers and privacy

Post by Nanu » Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:52 pm

Scubaregs wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:46 pm It's a way of saying there are far more important things in life to worry about. If it bothers you that much, sell the car.
And buy a deaf horse to get about on?
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Post by Russ Z4 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:05 pm

Pretty much!

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Post by Roadster_Surrey » Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:18 pm

There's a solution to that, driving car of certain age without gadgets. I love my 10y old 4x4, there's absolutely no gadgets in it. It just drives.

And yes, I don't like these connected features in new car as well and the fact, that BMW can change features of the car remotely.

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Post by Nanu » Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:05 pm

Don’t you have to accept the remote updates?

If the car is not paired with your phone or your internet service, how do they connect remotely with your car?
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Post by Russ Z4 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:12 pm

The car has its own data connection and SIM card.

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Post by BMW_User » Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:21 pm

Scubaregs wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:46 pm It's a way of saying there are far more important things in life to worry about. If it bothers you that much, sell the car.
You seem quite a naive chap. Sure you didn't study history... but what puzzle me of people like you is that you replied anyway without giving any contribution to the conversation. If is was for you, there would be no democracy, because, to quote you, "there are more important things in life"... What is that supposed to even mean...

Do me a favour, stop answering. People like you contribute zero to our society.
If you accept that something of your property that allows you to travel freely far and away is tracked 24/7 by a private company without even telling you explicitly and as an extension to that by the Government, you are beyond recoverable...

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Post by enuff_zed » Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:34 pm

Err… this is a car enthusiasts forum. If you want to talk to people about conspiracies, everyone watching you etc then you need www.mulderandscully.theyarewatchingus.com.
Honestly? It’s a fact of life. You want progress and everything to hand at the flick of a mouse then you have to live with the consequences.
If you need me I’ll be out having fun with the car that led me to join this forum 😉👍🏻
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Post by Roadster_Surrey » Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:37 pm

Nanu wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:05 pm Don’t you have to accept the remote updates?
Not the ones happening in the background. You can find thread about some options suddenly missing (automation of seats heating) or thread about Merry Christmas video showing on a screen. These things are just pushed to the cars.

You can setup privacy to high level but car will still be connected to internet and changes can still be applied.

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Post by BMW_User » Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:42 pm

enuff_zed wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:34 pm Err… this is a car enthusiasts forum. If you want to talk to people about conspiracies, everyone watching you etc then you need www.mulderandscully.theyarewatchingus.com.
Honestly? It’s a fact of life. You want progress and everything to hand at the flick of a mouse then you have to live with the consequences.
If you need me I’ll be out having fun with the car that led me to join this forum 😉👍🏻
Another bright guy over here...
What is the conspiracy? I'm talking about an existing connection between your car and the BMW servers and I'm talking about a piece of legislation that will force you to tell your mom - the Government - where you are every single second of you using the car.
Is your ignorance too broad for you to keep up with the conversation? It looks like the fair of intelligent people tonight...

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Post by Scubaregs » Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:44 pm

BMW_User wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:21 pm
Scubaregs wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:46 pm It's a way of saying there are far more important things in life to worry about. If it bothers you that much, sell the car.
You seem quite a naive chap. Sure you didn't study history... but what puzzle me of people like you is that you replied anyway without giving any contribution to the conversation. If is was for you, there would be no democracy, because, to quote you, "there are more important things in life"... What is that supposed to even mean...

Do me a favour, stop answering. People like you contribute zero to our society.
If you accept that something of your property that allows you to travel freely far and away is tracked 24/7 by a private company without even telling you explicitly and as an extension to that by the Government, you are beyond recoverable...
Lol noob, you seem rather naive as to how forums work. You don't get to dictate who answers in a thread. I suspect I'm a bit longer in the tooth than you are and I learnt a long time ago not to sweat the small stuff. :P
Abstinence is fine, in moderation.

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Car sim card, API connection to BMW Company servers and privacy

Post by BMW_User » Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:45 pm

Scubaregs wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:44 pm
BMW_User wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:21 pm
Scubaregs wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:46 pm It's a way of saying there are far more important things in life to worry about. If it bothers you that much, sell the car.
You seem quite a naive chap. Sure you didn't study history... but what puzzle me of people like you is that you replied anyway without giving any contribution to the conversation. If is was for you, there would be no democracy, because, to quote you, "there are more important things in life"... What is that supposed to even mean...

Do me a favour, stop answering. People like you contribute zero to our society.
If you accept that something of your property that allows you to travel freely far and away is tracked 24/7 by a private company without even telling you explicitly and as an extension to that by the Government, you are beyond recoverable...
Lol noob, you seem rather naive as to how forums work. You don't get to dictate who answers in a thread. I suspect I'm a bit longer in the tooth than you are and I learnt a long time ago not to sweat the small stuff. :P
I'm getting you used to what the Government will soon do with you, treating you like a child who doesn't behave... silly you.

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