Fuel rip off

[Matt1]

I’ve noticed when filling my diesel Mazda, that the pump seems to start charging me before the fuel is dispensed. Happens at various filling stations. I insert the nozzle, pull the trigger and for xx seconds I don’t hear any fuel going in the tank. There’s normally a characteristic “rushing” sound once the fuel is coming out the end of the filler nozzle and into my filler. Meanwhile of course the meter is running and at todays prices I can be paying well more than a £ before any fuel has come out the nozzle. Am seriously tempted to get a brand new can and try and prove this. Anybody else noticed this?

[Chris_D]

All pumps are supposed to be independently regulated to ensure the correct amount of fuel is dispensed.
however, all pumps are not built the same.
Would be interesting to conduct that experiment you suggest.

i regularly get chastised /shamed by petrol station managers over the tannoy here in nl whenever i lift the hose while keeping the valve open to ensure the fuel in the hose that i paid for has actually gone into the tank.
i couldn't actually give 2 fooks as its my right to take what i paid for and regularly argue the case for this to which i'm usually met with derision and defeat in equal measures.
A sure fire way of making sure you get all the fuel from the hose is to park on the side of the pump in order to stretch the hose to its full extended length to ensure you dont have a droop in the cable lower than your filler.
I'm usually smirked at by smarmy dutch drivers waiting behind me who initially think I've parked on the 'wrong' side of the pump, until i actually manage to easily extend the hose over to the other side of the car to start filling, thereby wiping the smugness off their stupid orange faces while i think to myself 'whose laughing now you big-toothed, orange-skinned, red pants-wearing a$$hole. Hahaha bwahahahaaa hahhaaaaaa, look it's working, see, no problemo and just for smirking at me, while i'm inside before paying i might just leisurely browse the assortment of confectionery, possibly even mull getting a saucijs broodje, or maybe taking a pee or a poo and make you wait a bit longer. Bwaaaaaahahhaaaaa'

Ok i went off at a bit of a tangent towards the end there admittedly.

[Pondrew]

I’ve noticed when filling my diesel Mazda, that the pump seems to start charging me before the fuel is dispensed. Happens at various filling stations. I insert the nozzle, pull the trigger and for xx seconds I don’t hear any fuel going in the tank. There’s normally a characteristic “rushing” sound once the fuel is coming out the end of the filler nozzle and into my filler. Meanwhile of course the meter is running and at todays prices I can be paying well more than a £ before any fuel has come out the nozzle. Am seriously tempted to get a brand new can and try and prove this. Anybody else noticed this?

I think this may have something to do with the amount of fuel in the hose when you arrive.
As Chris sort of eluded to above, there will an unknown amount of fuel in the hose from the previous user.
I calculated that a 40mm diameter hose at 2m in length (an educated guess) can hold 2.5 litres.
If there is very little fuel in the hose when you pull the trigger (ie if you followed Chris D to the pump) it will draw fuel from the pump but fill the hose first. Every drop going into the hose is recorded, but not every drop coming out of the nozzle necessarily The actual 'pump' in the dispensing/ measuring equipment (the pump), only starts once the pressure drops enough to start it (I think).

If you do what Chris D does after you've finished (not the pi$$ing off the locals bit), you should get everything you pay for and the extra in the hose when you start, therefore getting more than you pay for.

Disclaimer: The above is my best guess; I am not a petrol pump 'officianado'

[enuff_zed]

Chris_D, I think I've missed a bit somewhere?
How do you keep the valve open to empty the hose without the pressure drop being sensed and the pump kicking in again?

[pvr]

Thought you could only do that on the old serviced pumps where you had to move the handle to get the nozzle back in, which stopped the pump?

[pvr]

Oh - and I am even more irritating as when the pump is on the wrong side, I reverse into the petrol station

(just measured my teeth - seemed normal size and my skin is not quite orange yet )

[Chris_D]

Chris_D, I think I've missed a bit somewhere?
How do you keep the valve open to empty the hose without the pressure drop being sensed and the pump kicking in again?

No the point is you're maximising the yield from the hose from start to finish.
If you stretch and make sure there is no sag in the hose and its above the filler cap then you are collecting whatever was in the hose already as pondrew suggests.
If you keep the hose in that attitude when you release the handle to stop the pump then you may be collecting the residual fuel left in the pump hose even after the pump has stopped.

I remember being a bit startled on a trip to poland years ago where i was filling a 3L emergency can and nearly overfilling it when it was placed on the ground even though i stopped pumping. A small amount continued to come out of the nozzle and made me realise that there must be residual fuel left in the hose on any given pumping procedure.

But i doubt its the case everytime.
I think the idea warrants further investigation...

[Chris_D]

(just measured my teeth - seemed normal size and my skin is not quite orange yet )

I bet you wear red pants occasionally tho. Gowon admit it

[pvr]

That will never happen. That red or salmon colour, only really weird people wear that (or they are from The Hague)

[rdm05z4]

Interesting topic never thought of fuel left in hose. Most men wish for a longer hose then what is in it. Sorry could not resist the joke.

[Pondrew]

No the point is you're maximising the yield from the hose from start to finish.
If you stretch and make sure there is no sag in the hose and its above the filler cap then you are collecting whatever was in the hose already as pondrew suggests.
If you keep the hose in that attitude when you release the handle to stop the pump then you may be collecting the residual fuel left in the pump hose even after the pump has stopped.

I remember being a bit startled on a trip to poland years ago where i was filling a 3L emergency can and nearly overfilling it when it was placed on the ground even though i stopped pumping. A small amount continued to come out of the nozzle and made me realise that there must be residual fuel left in the hose on any given pumping procedure.

But i doubt its the case everytime.
I think the idea warrants further investigation...

If you really want to get your money's worth and pi$s the locals off even more, you could walk around every pump and feel which is heaviest then go to that one!

[Pondrew]

Most men wish for a longer hose

Strange that men do but women don't, apparently. Which is ideal in my case!

[Argyll Andy]

Most men wish for a longer hose

Strange that men do but women don't, apparently. Which is ideal in my case!

Yeah but ideally they want a hose, not a straw

[buzyg]

Chris_D, I think I've missed a bit somewhere?
How do you keep the valve open to empty the hose without the pressure drop being sensed and the pump kicking in again?

No the point is you're maximising the yield from the hose from start to finish.
If you stretch and make sure there is no sag in the hose and its above the filler cap then you are collecting whatever was in the hose already as pondrew suggests.
If you keep the hose in that attitude when you release the handle to stop the pump then you may be collecting the residual fuel left in the pump hose even after the pump has stopped.

I remember being a bit startled on a trip to poland years ago where i was filling a 3L emergency can and nearly overfilling it when it was placed on the ground even though i stopped pumping. A small amount continued to come out of the nozzle and made me realise that there must be residual fuel left in the hose on any given pumping procedure.

But i doubt its the case everytime.
I think the idea warrants further investigation...

You tight wad.

[Chris_D]

You tight wad.

Do the math Buzylar. For an average yield of say 300ml each time I visited the pump I reckon I’ve saved £100’s, if not £1000’s doing that over the years. I certainly know at the very least I got what I paid for.
Minimum effort, maximum return.