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E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
- Usel
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- Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:59 am
E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
Over the last few years there's been some interest in fitting E89 seats to an E85/6 since Yorkie fitted these many years ago but didn't provide much information so hopefully all answers will be in this thread given time. I have given this a go as a pair of manual heated M-Sports in beige at a breaker just down the road became available for just £180.
I have been waiting for a day without rain when I'm not working to finally have a test fit and today (25th March 2023) according to the forecast is that day. There was no rain due until midday and I was very lucky that at 11am with the roof down and battery disconnected the heavens opened and I got one throughly drenched interior and tools, 10 minutes later the sun is out
That's enough waffle but below is a brief summary of what's what for those wanting to just get on with it and I will do a more detailed write up with pictures later once I have completed test fitting.
Ok the electrics, you will need donor plugs from a pair of standard seats from an E85/6 but they have to be Electric and Heated:
Heated seats - E89 seats have a box underneath to control the heat pads, the E85 does all this from the centre console switch unit in front of the gear stick, so the box can be removed. You are left with 2 plugs from the heat pads which have exactly the same coloured wiring. Cut the plugs off the donor seats leaving long tails so you can connect the wires up.
Lordosis (inflated bolsters/back) - This is all controlled on board the seat you just need to provide 12v power. The basic setup is just inflated bolsters the more fancy seats have inflated back support as well. Regardless of which you choose the basic setup is the same wiring as the fancy and the basic can be retrofitted with fancy support bags if you so wish. There are 2 wires to connect and the colours red/black is positive and the brown is ground. You will need the donor plug from electric seats regardless of whether you chose manual or electric E89 seats. Connect the red/black to positive and brown to negative/ground.
Electric powered seats: I chose manual seats but the lordosis positive and electric seat positive are wired together and the same for the negative's.
Passenger seat occupancy sensor - you will need a sensor bypass. I don't know if it will work or not. Please see update on this for facelift cars.
Seat belt pretensioner - You will need the pretensioners from an E85/6. There are 4 wire's to connect and none of them need cutting and the pins are the same as the E85/6 so just remove them. The red and black goes into the place of the red and black of your E85/6 plug which is simple, this is for the sensor so the car knows you have your seat belt connected.
Now the head scratching and difficult bit for the pretensioner and I have guessed so need help with this but nothing blew up when I connected for testing. The E89 has Yellow and Blue, the E85 is not fussy and the polarity does not matter so they are Black and Black. The wire harness on the car (pre-facelift) has Red and Blue/Brown. I connected Yellow to Red and Blue to Blue/Brown. I don't know if this will fire in a crash but it didn't fire prematurely when I hooked up the power and started the car.
Seat Airbag - Identify the plug as it should be the only one left and don't connect it to anything. Yorkie removed the airbag from the seat but I don't see why that's needed and won't fire without power. To save weight or maybe it has value to be sold on?
Fitting of the rails:
I am trying to make a set of plates which everyone regardless of skill level should be able to make. I can weld and have access to welder at work but wanted to avoid that as most people don't have that luxury. You will need a pillar drill though and an angle grinder as well as other tools but those two are the most expensive ones you'll need.
My car is in the garage with only just enough room to get in and out so I have made plates blind but with seat bases from an E85/6 for guidance in my shed.
Now the rails on one side of the seat almost fit perfectly. With the rail mounted on the front bolt the rear hole is long by about 3-5mm. The bolt almost goes in so this hole needs elongating.
The width is too narrow on the e89 rails so they need to be widened. I, in my error, made plates to widen the seat buckle side but after test fitting realised I need to widen the rails on the seat controls side.
The plates I have made were actually spot on though for the measurements so I just need to re-make them for the otherside.
This is a work in progress and will be at least a week before I can make new plates and re-fit the seats before I can show you what to do.
The seat belt will bolt onto the seat fixing but will need spacers and a longer nut. More information on this to follow.
Anyway a few pictures and note the seat is incorrectly fitted and at maximum height, I am terrible with remembering to take pictures along the way but I will get more later which will help.
Heated Seat box
Wiring under E89 seat before anything changed
I have been waiting for a day without rain when I'm not working to finally have a test fit and today (25th March 2023) according to the forecast is that day. There was no rain due until midday and I was very lucky that at 11am with the roof down and battery disconnected the heavens opened and I got one throughly drenched interior and tools, 10 minutes later the sun is out
That's enough waffle but below is a brief summary of what's what for those wanting to just get on with it and I will do a more detailed write up with pictures later once I have completed test fitting.
Ok the electrics, you will need donor plugs from a pair of standard seats from an E85/6 but they have to be Electric and Heated:
Heated seats - E89 seats have a box underneath to control the heat pads, the E85 does all this from the centre console switch unit in front of the gear stick, so the box can be removed. You are left with 2 plugs from the heat pads which have exactly the same coloured wiring. Cut the plugs off the donor seats leaving long tails so you can connect the wires up.
Lordosis (inflated bolsters/back) - This is all controlled on board the seat you just need to provide 12v power. The basic setup is just inflated bolsters the more fancy seats have inflated back support as well. Regardless of which you choose the basic setup is the same wiring as the fancy and the basic can be retrofitted with fancy support bags if you so wish. There are 2 wires to connect and the colours red/black is positive and the brown is ground. You will need the donor plug from electric seats regardless of whether you chose manual or electric E89 seats. Connect the red/black to positive and brown to negative/ground.
Electric powered seats: I chose manual seats but the lordosis positive and electric seat positive are wired together and the same for the negative's.
Passenger seat occupancy sensor - you will need a sensor bypass. I don't know if it will work or not. Please see update on this for facelift cars.
Seat belt pretensioner - You will need the pretensioners from an E85/6. There are 4 wire's to connect and none of them need cutting and the pins are the same as the E85/6 so just remove them. The red and black goes into the place of the red and black of your E85/6 plug which is simple, this is for the sensor so the car knows you have your seat belt connected.
Now the head scratching and difficult bit for the pretensioner and I have guessed so need help with this but nothing blew up when I connected for testing. The E89 has Yellow and Blue, the E85 is not fussy and the polarity does not matter so they are Black and Black. The wire harness on the car (pre-facelift) has Red and Blue/Brown. I connected Yellow to Red and Blue to Blue/Brown. I don't know if this will fire in a crash but it didn't fire prematurely when I hooked up the power and started the car.
Seat Airbag - Identify the plug as it should be the only one left and don't connect it to anything. Yorkie removed the airbag from the seat but I don't see why that's needed and won't fire without power. To save weight or maybe it has value to be sold on?
Fitting of the rails:
I am trying to make a set of plates which everyone regardless of skill level should be able to make. I can weld and have access to welder at work but wanted to avoid that as most people don't have that luxury. You will need a pillar drill though and an angle grinder as well as other tools but those two are the most expensive ones you'll need.
My car is in the garage with only just enough room to get in and out so I have made plates blind but with seat bases from an E85/6 for guidance in my shed.
Now the rails on one side of the seat almost fit perfectly. With the rail mounted on the front bolt the rear hole is long by about 3-5mm. The bolt almost goes in so this hole needs elongating.
The width is too narrow on the e89 rails so they need to be widened. I, in my error, made plates to widen the seat buckle side but after test fitting realised I need to widen the rails on the seat controls side.
The plates I have made were actually spot on though for the measurements so I just need to re-make them for the otherside.
This is a work in progress and will be at least a week before I can make new plates and re-fit the seats before I can show you what to do.
The seat belt will bolt onto the seat fixing but will need spacers and a longer nut. More information on this to follow.
Anyway a few pictures and note the seat is incorrectly fitted and at maximum height, I am terrible with remembering to take pictures along the way but I will get more later which will help.
Heated Seat box
Wiring under E89 seat before anything changed
Last edited by Usel on Fri Mar 31, 2023 2:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.
- Usel
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- Posts: 849
- Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:59 am
E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
Passenger seat occupancy sensor update for facelift cars.
The wire colours coming from the e89 seat occupancy sensor are the same colours as the wires from a facelift sensor pad. I can't test if this will work as my car is pre-facelift.
E85/6 facelift sensor wiring:
E89 wires coming from sensor:
Passenger Seat Occupancy Sensor for Pre-facelift cars
Refer back to this once you have completed the wiring guide below but you will need the seat occupancy sensor module from underneath the passenger seat and then purchase a seat occupancy sensor bypass. Both parts are in the below photograph.
Cable tie the seat occupancy sensor module onto the bracket where the heated seat module once was
Now connect all your block connectors into the main yellow block connector
Tidy all your cables and you should have one left which is for the air bag, which can also just be tidied out of the way as you don't need to do anything with this connector and that's the wiring done.
A Wiring Guide for the Electronics:
Under the seat you'll find a yellow box:
If you hold open two tabs you can slide the connectors out from inside.
Bottom left is for electric seat, the Lordosis, seat occupancy sensor and heated seat.
Left is for the pretensioner
Next to that on the right is for the Air bag
Far right and slightly out of focus is the heated seat connector which goes into the heated seat module.
The wire colours coming from the e89 seat occupancy sensor are the same colours as the wires from a facelift sensor pad. I can't test if this will work as my car is pre-facelift.
E85/6 facelift sensor wiring:
E89 wires coming from sensor:
Passenger Seat Occupancy Sensor for Pre-facelift cars
Refer back to this once you have completed the wiring guide below but you will need the seat occupancy sensor module from underneath the passenger seat and then purchase a seat occupancy sensor bypass. Both parts are in the below photograph.
Cable tie the seat occupancy sensor module onto the bracket where the heated seat module once was
Now connect all your block connectors into the main yellow block connector
Tidy all your cables and you should have one left which is for the air bag, which can also just be tidied out of the way as you don't need to do anything with this connector and that's the wiring done.
A Wiring Guide for the Electronics:
Under the seat you'll find a yellow box:
If you hold open two tabs you can slide the connectors out from inside.
Bottom left is for electric seat, the Lordosis, seat occupancy sensor and heated seat.
Left is for the pretensioner
Next to that on the right is for the Air bag
Far right and slightly out of focus is the heated seat connector which goes into the heated seat module.
Last edited by Usel on Sat Apr 01, 2023 9:52 pm, edited 4 times in total.
- Usel
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- Posts: 849
- Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:59 am
E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
Pretensioner Wiring
Pretensioner Connector
Wires
Remove Red and Black wires
Connect them into donor plug from e85/6
Now looks like this
Remove Yellow and Blue wires
Remove green rubber and tighten top clips up where green rubber was connected, make sure they are as rounded over as possible.
Remove Yellow block connector from e85/6 seats and remove both black wires
Insert Yellow and Blue wires into e85/6 Yellow Block connector. Whichever way round you prefer as I don't know which is the correct way round but connecting them the way I have does not make the pre-tensioner fire when you connect the battery and start the car. I have no idea if connecting them this way that the pre-tensioner will fire in the event of a crash.
Insert Black plug in Yellow block connector
Pretensioner Connector
Wires
Remove Red and Black wires
Connect them into donor plug from e85/6
Now looks like this
Remove Yellow and Blue wires
Remove green rubber and tighten top clips up where green rubber was connected, make sure they are as rounded over as possible.
Remove Yellow block connector from e85/6 seats and remove both black wires
Insert Yellow and Blue wires into e85/6 Yellow Block connector. Whichever way round you prefer as I don't know which is the correct way round but connecting them the way I have does not make the pre-tensioner fire when you connect the battery and start the car. I have no idea if connecting them this way that the pre-tensioner will fire in the event of a crash.
Insert Black plug in Yellow block connector
Last edited by Usel on Sat Mar 25, 2023 5:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- Usel
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- Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:59 am
E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
Heated Seat Wiring:
Heated Seat Module
Remove it so you are left with these 2 connectors, tuck the 3rd connector out of the way for now as it's not needed.
Snip the connectors off like so
Cut back the sleeve and remove the insulation from the ends
Cut the connectors off the donor e85/6 seat base
Expose the wires and see they are a perfect match from e85/6 to e89
Connect them up
Wrap in self amalgamating tape or something of your preference
Lordosis Wiring
Here is the main connector from the e89 seat with the heated seat module connector to the right.
Remove the sheath, it's sticky and quite difficult.
Heated Seat Module
Remove it so you are left with these 2 connectors, tuck the 3rd connector out of the way for now as it's not needed.
Snip the connectors off like so
Cut back the sleeve and remove the insulation from the ends
Cut the connectors off the donor e85/6 seat base
Expose the wires and see they are a perfect match from e85/6 to e89
Connect them up
Wrap in self amalgamating tape or something of your preference
Lordosis Wiring
Here is the main connector from the e89 seat with the heated seat module connector to the right.
Remove the sheath, it's sticky and quite difficult.
Last edited by Usel on Sat Apr 01, 2023 9:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.
- Usel
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- Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:59 am
E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
Pull out the pins and put to one side, we will need this in a moment.
Passenger seat only* find the connector at the back of the seat base and unclip it. The connector to the left is the one you now need to untangle back to the main connector block
Remove the pins from the main connector block
Now remove the last 2 pins from the main connector block. These are for the Lordosis
From the heated seat loom you just put to one side remove one of the large spade connectors. Very difficult, use a pair of side cutters to carefully open the tabs and remove the wire
Connect the spade connector to the red/black wire for the Lordosis
From the e85/6 seat remove the pins from the electric motor connector.
Slide the pin of the brown wire (ground) for the Lordosis into number 14
Slide the pin of the red/black (positive) for the Lordosis into number 13
Wrap wires in self amalgamating tape
Now go back to the top of the 2nd post in this thread to finish off.
Passenger seat only* find the connector at the back of the seat base and unclip it. The connector to the left is the one you now need to untangle back to the main connector block
Remove the pins from the main connector block
Now remove the last 2 pins from the main connector block. These are for the Lordosis
From the heated seat loom you just put to one side remove one of the large spade connectors. Very difficult, use a pair of side cutters to carefully open the tabs and remove the wire
Connect the spade connector to the red/black wire for the Lordosis
From the e85/6 seat remove the pins from the electric motor connector.
Slide the pin of the brown wire (ground) for the Lordosis into number 14
Slide the pin of the red/black (positive) for the Lordosis into number 13
Wrap wires in self amalgamating tape
Now go back to the top of the 2nd post in this thread to finish off.
Last edited by Usel on Sat Apr 01, 2023 10:02 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Onlinebigwinn
- Lifer
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E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
If the forum helped you, why not help the forum back. Thats the Z4 way!
EWS Delete PM me
Coding- airbags etc PM me
EWS Delete PM me
Coding- airbags etc PM me
- M@_
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E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
I was just lamenting my choices and you dropped a new option gift wrapped! Great write up.
2003 3.0i
- Usel
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- Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:59 am
E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
Thanks Bigwinn, hoping to order some connectors and plugs from LLL so people haven't got to sacrifice their standard seats to do the wiring.
I know the photo of the seat looks stupid but it will fit perfectly when I have the brackets fitted properly. The ones I made for the drivers seat actually fit the passenger seat in the correct place so it wasn't wasted time. Also the seats will look better when cleaned and repainted New England Beige.
I know the photo of the seat looks stupid but it will fit perfectly when I have the brackets fitted properly. The ones I made for the drivers seat actually fit the passenger seat in the correct place so it wasn't wasted time. Also the seats will look better when cleaned and repainted New England Beige.
Last edited by Usel on Sun Mar 26, 2023 2:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- Usel
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- enuff_zed
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E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
Usel, I can see a nice little sideline in conversion kits and instructions developing
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E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
Usel, Absolutely superb, such a thorough and well documented job! I think that there'll be a lot of interest in carrying out this improvement.
Pre-facelift E85 3.0i SE with manual gearbox - written off by insurer
Some accessories for sale now and in the future.
Some accessories for sale now and in the future.
- BumpyZ4
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E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
Very interested in seeing the bracket. I'm glad you are so detailed orientated!
2003 E85 3.0i Sterling Gray
KLR 650
Diva Roadster (Kit Car)
KLR 650
Diva Roadster (Kit Car)
- Usel
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- Posts: 849
- Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:59 am
E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
Hopefully more information about this on Monday if Sunday is a day with no rain. I only have some electrics to finish on the passenger seat as waiting to get hold of an electric powered seat connector and both seats are ready to be fitted.
Found out my friend has a plasma cutter so will hopefully do a small run on some brackets to help others. Have a sheet of metal plate coming friday so fingers crossed.
Anyway a picture of the passenger seat base before and after as the previous owner must have had a dog. Unusually the passenger is in worse condition than the drivers seat.
- SqerrNipz
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E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
Looking really good, all the hard work paying off
Proud owner of ‘Xavier’ - Maldive blue, 2004 3.0 auto. Heated/electric msports, style 107’s, gravity performance exhaust, E46 330i brakes, custom heated steering wheel, custom carbon intake, lots of other tweaks!
- Usel
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- Posts: 849
- Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:59 am
E89 M-Sports in an E85/E86
I had to go out on Sunday so didn't have much time, I watchd the F1 race and then by 8am I had the car out the garage and started to put the seats in. By 10am I had to get ready to go out.
Finished painting the seats Saturday night so now with them fitted it almost looks OEM to me.
I got home late afternoon and then took the car out for a spin.
Positives:
Very comfortable, feels like a mixture of the e85 standard seat base and sports seat back.
Seat Heating worked perfectly.
Lordosis inflated bolsters worked perfectly. Amazing how much they tightened onto you. With them pumped right up it felt like someone giving you a bear hug from behind, too much for me really. About half pumped for spirited driving and fully deflated for relaxed driving was perfect for me.
Seats go really low like my standard seats.
They look great
Negatives:
I'm 6ft 1" and any taller you'll struggle with leg room.
The airbag light came on. Either a loose connection, the bypass not working or a faulty pretensioner.
I ran out of time and effort so hopefully with the long weekend I will be able to finish off and update you all on how to make the brackets.
Finished painting the seats Saturday night so now with them fitted it almost looks OEM to me.
I got home late afternoon and then took the car out for a spin.
Positives:
Very comfortable, feels like a mixture of the e85 standard seat base and sports seat back.
Seat Heating worked perfectly.
Lordosis inflated bolsters worked perfectly. Amazing how much they tightened onto you. With them pumped right up it felt like someone giving you a bear hug from behind, too much for me really. About half pumped for spirited driving and fully deflated for relaxed driving was perfect for me.
Seats go really low like my standard seats.
They look great
Negatives:
I'm 6ft 1" and any taller you'll struggle with leg room.
The airbag light came on. Either a loose connection, the bypass not working or a faulty pretensioner.
I ran out of time and effort so hopefully with the long weekend I will be able to finish off and update you all on how to make the brackets.