Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Specific discussion about the E89 2009 Z4 (sDrive35is, sDrive35i, sDrive30i, sDrive23i)
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mr wilks
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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by mr wilks » Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:25 am

Chris1712 wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:17 am
Z4M-2006 wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 7:56 pm
What kinda year are you buying in 997 C4s for £45k.. Maybe 10 plate?..... Would the F type be 4/5 years newer with lower mileage ?

Late 997's are something i dont really look at,i cant see value in them really. Conversely i can see a lot of value in an early 997,lovely looking car that can be bought for under £20k with sensible miles.
Yep for sure the F Type would be newer, but I don't really care about age/mileage just that the car is 'better' and I can afford it's amortised running costs over X miles / years.

I have a spreadsheet for all costs, and add new cars/columns all the time to see what my budget allows.

My 35iS looks like this:
Per mile £0.91
Fuel per mile £0.19
Tax per mile £0.05
Service/Warranty per mile £0.09
Depreciation per mile £0.55

R8 V8 S-Tronic looks like this:
Per mile £1.20
Fuel per mile £0.25
Tax per mile £0.08
Service/Warranty per mile £0.18
Depreciation per mile £0.60

So affordable but pushing it, the warranty is what kills the R8 for me. Over £100 a month I wonder if it's really worth it or I should take the risk myself.
£45k is into 991 territory , decent gen2 997 should be got easily for £32k/£36k
I see half your running costs are from depreciation ?
A 997 of either gen if bought wisely would avoid most if not all that cost :wink:
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E89 23i
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E86
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35is

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Chris1712
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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by Chris1712 » Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:38 am

mr wilks wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:25 am
£45k is into 991 territory , decent gen2 997 should be got easily for £32k/£36k
I see half your running costs are from depreciation ?
A 997 of either gen if bought wisely would avoid most if not all that cost :wink:
Yes it is into 991 territory, but not widebody. Personally I think it makes a dramatic change the looks and for me it would be worth it. So I'm looking at 997.2 C4S PDK (daily, cba with manual), £35k definitely seems the bottom of the market but maybe that's the place to be? Still concerned of warranty costs, they're not the most reliable brand and it looks like parts costs are pretty high.

I'd still expect a £35k 997.2 to lose say 3.5-4 grand a year, especially as you'll be nudging 100k total mileage when you come to sell. Food for thought though, I need to find a friendly dealer so I can see what all the 911 fuss is about :poke: .
Pure Traction 35iS - Sold!
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mr wilks
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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by mr wilks » Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:01 am

Chris1712 wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:38 am
mr wilks wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:25 am
£45k is into 991 territory , decent gen2 997 should be got easily for £32k/£36k
I see half your running costs are from depreciation ?
A 997 of either gen if bought wisely would avoid most if not all that cost :wink:
Yes it is into 991 territory, but not widebody. Personally I think it makes a dramatic change the looks and for me it would be worth it. So I'm looking at 997.2 C4S PDK (daily, cba with manual), £35k definitely seems the bottom of the market but maybe that's the place to be? Still concerned of warranty costs, they're not the most reliable brand and it looks like parts costs are pretty high.

I'd still expect a £35k 997.2 to lose say 3.5-4 grand a year, especially as you'll be nudging 100k total mileage when you come to sell. Food for thought though, I need to find a friendly dealer so I can see what all the 911 fuss is about :poke: .
We all see things different , use our cars different & additionally some accept that depreciation is a major part of car ownership , it can be negated in a variety of ways .
The 991 is a far bigger car than 997 , i don't think the need for the wider body is the same & even with 997 the actual difference between C2/C4 is less prominent than it was on the 996 C2/C4
If i was spending circa £45k in a 911 right now id much prefer that in a low spec 991 C2 than a high spec 997 C4S , imo depreciation will be far less , the 991 are merging with the 997.2 & that itself is driving down the higher end of the 997 .

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified ... 500&page=1
Previous Zs :roll:
E86
E85
///MR
Si E85
E89 23i
Si E85
E86
3.0Si E85
///MR
35i Msport 6spd
E86
///MR
E86
35is

911 997 Carrera4


Image

https://www.instagram.com/andy911wheels/

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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by Chris1712 » Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:28 am

mr wilks wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 11:01 am

We all see things different , use our cars different & additionally some accept that depreciation is a major part of car ownership , it can be negated in a variety of ways .
The 991 is a far bigger car than 997 , i don't think the need for the wider body is the same & even with 997 the actual difference between C2/C4 is less prominent than it was on the 996 C2/C4
If i was spending circa £45k in a 911 right now id much prefer that in a low spec 991 C2 than a high spec 997 C4S , imo depreciation will be far less , the 991 are merging with the 997.2 & that itself is driving down the higher end of the 997 .

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified ... 500&page=1
Yes absolutely, I know all of these things will cost me an arm and a leg but I like to at least have a good idea what I'm getting in to! Agreed on the 991, didn't realise they were quite that cheap yet tbh.

Again though what's the warranty situation, I need to do the 111 point check and then how much? This is one huge advantage BMW has, extremely affordable warranties. It's my only car and a daily, I cannot afford to be without it. Only last month my 35iS was off the road for 2 weeks to replace a couple sensors, 2 weeks 4-series rental + 6 hours labour came to a very large bill!
Pure Traction 35iS - Sold!
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Z4M-2006
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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by Z4M-2006 » Fri Sep 20, 2019 6:00 pm

The 111 point check is usually £120..

Then a Porsche warranty is quite cheap in relation to parts/labour costs. IIRC it was around £1600 for 2 years on my 2014 32k 981 Cayman.

I cant even imagine to what level the dealers would want a 10 yr old 997 to be in to warranty it and at what cost ?

The 991 is an absolutely awesome machine,it really is at at different level to the 996/997 even the late Gen 2 stuff. I echo Mr wilks sentiments in that i wouldnt even contemplate a late 997 if an early 991 was on the cards. Would be cheaper to get warranty on and im fairly sure that its under the 2 yr service regime too.

I truly do admire the man that gets costings down to the penny and spread sheets etc etc,but with a Jag,Porsche or BMW a big bill could come your way and bugger up the numbers.
The Porsche warranty is ok,but they want to reject every possible claim you make under "wear and tear" clauses. I had to literally scream at them in the showroom to prove what they were talking to me was complete bollocks..

BMW are getting slowly worse and can be a bit crap,although the smiling faces are ok the level of workmanship is genuinely just above monkey level,and some of the parts prices now are laughably expensive.

I have had 3 Jags and they have always treated me very well,and parts and services have always been surprisingly cheap.. I think a major service on a V8 F type is under £500 whereas just on my Cayman it was close to £900...

Food for thought,all great cars...Good luck in your search

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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by step_change » Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:58 pm

At 62500 on a March 2013 plate, I'm keeping mine for the foreseeable. It's a beaut and not a rattle on it.
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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by john-e89 » Sat Sep 21, 2019 10:20 am

step_change wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:58 pm
At 62500 on a March 2013 plate, I'm keeping mine for the foreseeable. It's a beaut and not a rattle on it.
Not surprising, Melbourne red suits these cars so well. :thumbsup:
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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by ronk » Sun Sep 22, 2019 12:07 pm

Chris1712 wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:17 am

I have a spreadsheet for all costs, and add new cars/columns all the time to see what my budget allows.

My 35iS looks like this:
Per mile £0.91
Fuel per mile £0.19
Tax per mile £0.05
Service/Warranty per mile £0.09
Depreciation per mile £0.55
When the dealer tried to sell me an M40i recently, I did a spread sheet, albeit not as detailed - against my time of ownership, low miles and price offered the spreadsheet screamed “ keep the car”
You don't stop playing when you get old - You get old when you stop playing!
So I bought a 35is with all the toys to play with. :thumbsup:

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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by Z4M-2006 » Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:13 pm

ronk wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 12:07 pm
Chris1712 wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:17 am

I have a spreadsheet for all costs, and add new cars/columns all the time to see what my budget allows.

My 35iS looks like this:
Per mile £0.91
Fuel per mile £0.19
Tax per mile £0.05
Service/Warranty per mile £0.09
Depreciation per mile £0.55
When the dealer tried to sell me an M40i recently, I did a spread sheet, albeit not as detailed - against my time of ownership, low miles and price offered the spreadsheet screamed “ keep the car”
I bet it would... Depreciation on an M40i must be savage.

Apart from that i would think they are fairly frugal to run?

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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by ronk » Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:24 pm

I was looking at £28k to change at 33months of use and 9.5k miles - add the same hit (or more) for the M40i and it’s a definite no!
You don't stop playing when you get old - You get old when you stop playing!
So I bought a 35is with all the toys to play with. :thumbsup:

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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by Z4M-2006 » Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:49 pm

ronk wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:24 pm
I was looking at £28k to change at 33months of use and 9.5k miles - add the same hit (or more) for the M40i and it’s a definite no!
Did you buy your 35is from new ?

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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by ronk » Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:04 pm

I did.
Yes I know it’s not the best way to buy but I was fairly certain at the time that I was going to keep it for a long time. It’s got all the toys I could think of and the car was treated with respect during the run in period and still is while the oil is not up to full temperature. It is put away every winter and only comes out in the Springtime after the salt is well flushed away.
Basically it lives a sainted life!

At my age the car will outlast me! :rofl:
You don't stop playing when you get old - You get old when you stop playing!
So I bought a 35is with all the toys to play with. :thumbsup:

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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by Angelus666 » Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:16 pm

I don't see the value in the £50k 7-year-old 911. If you keep it 3 years you're likely to be in at another £10k in running costs. It'll then give you £35k back come sale time.

You're probably better off ordering a new one on lease and spending the £30k over the same term.

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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by mr wilks » Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:26 pm

Angelus666 wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:16 pm
I don't see the value in the £50k 7-year-old 911. If you keep it 3 years you're likely to be in at another £10k in running costs. It'll then give you £35k back come sale time.

You're probably better off ordering a new one on lease and spending the £30k over the same term.
That's probably good sense but id assume that most buyers into £40k/£50k 911 territory are trading up therefore already having a good lump of the money in their current cars & see it as a " affordable " move up the ladder throwing in £10k/£15k knowing if they need the cash they can downsize out & release ?
The guys blowing big numbers on leasing £80k/£100k cars are most likely doing so through business & unlikely to ever consider buying / owning a older car outright .
All factors that are currently highlighted with a stagnant performance car market whether that's £5k or £50k , folks just seem reluctant to twist right now & that is hurting used car values especially luxury ones
Previous Zs :roll:
E86
E85
///MR
Si E85
E89 23i
Si E85
E86
3.0Si E85
///MR
35i Msport 6spd
E86
///MR
E86
35is

911 997 Carrera4


Image

https://www.instagram.com/andy911wheels/

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Have 35is prices bottomed out yet?

Post by Chris1712 » Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:28 pm

Angelus666 wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:16 pm
I don't see the value in the £50k 7-year-old 911. If you keep it 3 years you're likely to be in at another £10k in running costs. It'll then give you £35k back come sale time.

You're probably better off ordering a new one on lease and spending the £30k over the same term.
If you can find me a £690/m lease on a 992 Carrera S I’ll take it!
Pure Traction 35iS - Sold!
Carbon Black E86 3.0si Coupe - Gone but not forgotten

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