World Trade Centre Dustification

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TitanTim
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Post by TitanTim » Sat May 19, 2018 6:24 pm

PerryGunn wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 6:13 pm
TitanTim wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 5:46 pm
Freefall or not, the towers collapsed in around 10 seconds so it may as well been freefall give or take a few seconds
That statement is a prime example of why arguing with conspiracy theorists is a waste of time, facts are ignored or twisted to support their views...

...so I won't bother visiting you in cloud-cuckoo land again... :P
So you think a few floors collapsing would have destroyed the entire tower, no way in 10 seconds, I don't need scientific diagrams I saw it with my own eyes on the day. Those towers collapsed on an instant, only one thing can help that along and thats demolition.

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Post by TitanTim » Sat May 19, 2018 6:32 pm

john-e89 wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 6:23 pm
It’s an aluminium tube with 90,000 litres of fuel on board, I’d imagine that has some bearing on things.....
The fuel burnt off very quickly, thermal imaging cameras just before the towers collapsed showed core temps to be very low, only a few hundred degrees C, not 1000s of degrees what people were led to believe and not high enough to have compromised the structure. The point is even if the upper floors had collapsed and pulled the outer walls in the downward inertia and mass would not have been enough to destroy the lower levels all the way down to virtually ground levels in the speed in which it did. That for me is enough to convince me the whole process was helped along.

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Post by john-e89 » Sat May 19, 2018 6:35 pm

TitanTim wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 6:32 pm
john-e89 wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 6:23 pm
It’s an aluminium tube with 90,000 litres of fuel on board, I’d imagine that has some bearing on things.....
The fuel burnt off very quickly, thermal imaging cameras just before the towers collapsed showed core temps to be very low, only a few hundred degrees C, not 1000s of degrees what people were led to believe and not high enough to have compromised the structure. The point is even if the upper floors had collapsed and pulled the outer walls in the downward inertia and mass would not have been enough to destroy the lower levels all the way down to virtually ground levels in the speed in which it did. That for me is enough to convince me the whole process was helped along.

Tim.
By whom...?? Mass murder inspired demolition experts??

Read my post on page 5 Tim, tells you all you need to know.
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Post by TitanTim » Sat May 19, 2018 7:15 pm

john-e89 wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 6:35 pm
TitanTim wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 6:32 pm
john-e89 wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 6:23 pm
It’s an aluminium tube with 90,000 litres of fuel on board, I’d imagine that has some bearing on things.....
The fuel burnt off very quickly, thermal imaging cameras just before the towers collapsed showed core temps to be very low, only a few hundred degrees C, not 1000s of degrees what people were led to believe and not high enough to have compromised the structure. The point is even if the upper floors had collapsed and pulled the outer walls in the downward inertia and mass would not have been enough to destroy the lower levels all the way down to virtually ground levels in the speed in which it did. That for me is enough to convince me the whole process was helped along.

Tim.
By whom...?? Mass murder inspired demolition experts??

Read my post on page 5 Tim, tells you all you need to know.
I read it John. Theories put forward are credable but I'm not convinced simply because I find it impossible for all the conditions to be present through both towers so they fell in exactly the same way. You could argue well yes they would have collapsed in the same manner as built the same but I can't accept personally that all the conditions were perfect for the both to collapse as cleanly as they did. If say one had half collapsed the other three quarters I could believe the theories you posted on page five would be more credible but I'm just not convinced by it. There is also the issue of why the towers turned to dust in the way they did. The tops of the towers collapsing and having the downward inertia to completely pulverise the lower levels still doesn't cut it for me. Even if the lower structure had been compromised through heat I still don't accept how the lower floors were so cleanly pulverised leaving only a few floors standing at ground level. The pancake theory would only hold true fir me if there were no central cores or strength.

For me demolition is more credible as it's removing the floors more cleanly and you would get that effect as was seen on the day i.e. total destruction as opposed to partial destruction due to failing steel beams, part collapsed floors and walls etc.

It was all too clean and perfect for me for a simple collapse.

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Post by john-e89 » Sat May 19, 2018 7:37 pm

!!!!
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Post by Nictrix » Sat May 19, 2018 8:02 pm

Tim, John has spoken and given his thoughts so if you have opposing views you must be wrong :lol:
On the subjects of theories though, does this mean we should not believe in the big bang theory and just believe in the Adam and Eve story instead?
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Post by Nanu » Sat May 19, 2018 8:51 pm

One thing to consider is if the conspiracy theory is true (I dont think it is but) how many people must be in on the plan? It would only take one of a lot of people to blow the whistle or slip up just the once for the plot to come tumbling down so to speak. Imagine if you were one of those people the power you would hold over some very important people would be immense. People don't or can't keep secrets like that for very long.

It doesn't help the conspiracy theorists any that most if not all those involved had links to Saudi Arabia including Bin Laden.
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Post by TitanTim » Sat May 19, 2018 9:01 pm

Nictrix wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 8:02 pm
Tim, John has spoken and given his thoughts so if you have opposing views you must be wrong :lol:
On the subjects of theories though, does this mean we should not believe in the big bang theory and just believe in the Adam and Eve story instead?
I'm enjoying the replies :thumbsup:

If you look up some of Dr Judy Woods presentations on youtube about the collapse and the fires, toasted cars etc she picks up on some very good questions for which there are no straightforward answers.

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Post by jabber » Sat May 19, 2018 9:14 pm

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Post by john-e89 » Sat May 19, 2018 9:37 pm

Nictrix wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 8:02 pm
Tim, John has spoken and given his thoughts so if you have opposing views you must be wrong :lol:
On the subjects of theories though, does this mean we should not believe in the big bang theory and just believe in the Adam and Eve story instead?
Correct..... :thumbsup: :wink:

I’m not asking anyone to agree with me, I’m just asking someone, anyone to tell me how you could amass a bunch of murderers, that is all. So far no one can, and unless one is a complete knuckle dragging half wit it’s a fair question that has more than a little to do with it.
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Post by TitanTim » Sat May 19, 2018 10:12 pm

john-e89 wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 9:37 pm
Nictrix wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 8:02 pm
Tim, John has spoken and given his thoughts so if you have opposing views you must be wrong :lol:
On the subjects of theories though, does this mean we should not believe in the big bang theory and just believe in the Adam and Eve story instead?
Correct..... :thumbsup: :wink:

I’m not asking anyone to agree with me, I’m just asking someone, anyone to tell me how you could amass a bunch of murderers, that is all. So far no one can, and unless one is a complete knuckle dragging half wit it’s a fair question that has more than a little to do with it.
One way of looking at it John is it would be so incredible that no-one would believe it.

I just have an open mind, I do think Dr Judy Wood has opened up a can of worms and her thoughts that the towers were affectively vaporised as they fell leaving little of them left on the ground. When you think about it she has a point.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdagKYOlxEM

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Post by SeanConnor » Sat May 19, 2018 10:43 pm

Dr Judy Wood also believes in

Tesla death rays.

Free energy but errr... she's not quite sure how it works.

Weather control conducted by sinister world government agencies.

The easter bunny .... oh sorry I made that one up.

She is generally considered as a complete irrational by her peer group.

Just because you have a Ph.D and have published papers in certain fields (she's an interferometrist for god's sake) does not grant you cedibility in others. I remember a professor of chemistry who was a lauded expert in his field but who was a creationist and refused to accept carbon dating and regression (mathematical that is).

She has made a very good living out of this over the years.

Have a look at her Facebook page and note her scientific rigour and that of her followers

FFS This is the real world not some f***ing shadowy conspiracy laden dreamland.

If you want to argue then quote teal numbers and use real science. There is no such thing as 'downward inertia' the phrase has no meaning. Quote masses and accelerations. There is no meaning to phrases such as 'massively strong' . Quote sheer strengths , torsional loads , commpressional forces etc etc.

The most often used weapon of the conspiracist is weak logic and poor science.

Rant over time for a G&T and bed :D
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Post by dans6490 » Sat May 19, 2018 10:49 pm

IMO both stories are ridiculous and far fetched but seemingly one of them or a version of it, is the truth.

The fact remains that the US managed to amass thousands of people from various countries, some of whom murdered people and we watched it unfold on our tv screens in the name of WMD. They convinced entire nations that it was the “right” thing to do.

I wouldn’t put anything past such a country that is willing to literally say and do anything to get what it wants.

So it’s believable that multiple planes can be hijacked in the most well protected country in the world and then also all can deviate from their flight plans and fly into buildings using a high degree of skill, without any fighter jets intercepting them.........but the very same “terrorists” couldn’t get access to the twin towers and rig them with explosives??

I’m not saying that’s what I believe but it’s not beyond the realms of possibility, certainly no less plausible than the hijackings, that seemingly is believable.
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Post by thanatu55 » Sat May 19, 2018 10:56 pm

john-e89 wrote:
Sat May 19, 2018 5:23 pm
Where do you stand on the mass murder job application point thanatu?

Ok, first off I am royally cheesed off that I already wrote out this entire thing once, clicked send and it disappeared! Maybe I've stumbled upon something they don't want putting out there... more likely I'm paranoid and a bit of an idiot for writing such a long piece without saving it. But I'm sticking to my guns and seeing it through.

Now then, no John, I don't believe a scenario ever took place where thousands of applications went out to would-be mass murderers. Whether I believe such a debacle would need that amount of input is another matter.

Let's stick with the narrative that a few lunatics simply hijacked two planes and hit the towers. I'm not denying that happened, we all saw it. But let's say for instance that for whatever reason, maybe weeks, maybe years before, the charges that would enable a controlled demolition were already present. Maybe a fallback procedure, security, I don't know. Two planes have just hit the towers, they're engulfed in flames, the buildings have been evacuated to realistically their maximum possible ability. There's no possible chance of safely getting to those stuck high up. Effectively now what you have playing out on live TV to the entire world is thousands of people slowly burning alive, people are jumping out of windows, America has just been humiliated by one man and his merry band of men. All that's left to do now is to let the world watch on as it plays out until it's end (families, children, patriots), still live on air! It could take hours, days even to play out (see Grenfell). Only very few select senior officials have the clearance to suggest or ask for the next possible steps to take. An idea is floated among them, the buildings are already strapped up, the men (or women) stall on it for a moment to contemplate every possible step and every outcome. They then get a call from the one man who has the ultimate say... reluctantly, "Take them down". It closes the chapter on an event that would only get worse and America can now deal with the aftermath. Could I envision a scenario along those lines being a reality, honestly, yes.

Now obviously there are holes in that theory. These are just idea's thrown out there directly from my tiny brain, not from any documentary or conspirasist that I know of. Why didn't both towers go down at the same time then? Why indeed. Or alternatively, why did it take tower one, every bit identical to tower two, far far faaar longer to burn before it fell than the second tower? I don't know.

Moving on. Let's say both towers went down exactly as described in the official reports and the theories are all a load of rubbish. Did someone see an opportunity to take down building 7 during all the fracas? It's on fire, it's empty, maybe cut your losses? Maybe there's even an insurance job in there. What I have not been satisfactorily convinced of is that it was brought down by fire, not a plane, in a manner that looks even more like a controlled demolition than the twin towers did.

Let's say that whole event really did go as the official reports say. It still doesn't explain to me how a boeing 757 disappeared into a hole that it is physically impossible to fit through by pulling off a maneuver that it was not aerodynamically designed to make, by amateur pilots, leaving behind no evidence - physical, video or other - that it ever happened. What does strike my attention is that a military jet that can be flown unmanned (therefore no kamikaze pilots) and is designed to pull off the sort of maneuver required with pinpoint accuracy, is roughly the size of the small hole made in the side of the Pentagon. Add into that the fact that it hit the exact spot where, unusually, nobody was due to be in that part of the building on that very day. Hence, no casualties. Is it possible that the towers incident is an entirely separate issue to that of the Pentagon? Maybe someone decided that in whole drama of the moment, an attack on the Federal government in a country renound for it's patriotism, would really drive home a war on terror with the American people. A false flag operation maybe (these do exist).

Like I said, these are just ideas I'm putting out there, I have no idea whether they did or even could happen. But nor do they involve thousands of mass murdering job applicants. All I'm saying is my stance is and always has been that there are loose ends, however small, that haven't been sufficiently explained and I 'believe' that we will never know the entire truth of that day. Some believe they have all of the answers, and I respect their right to claim so, I just don't believe it to be the case.

I did this damn thing twice, at least applaud the effort! :wink:
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Post by MrPT » Sat May 19, 2018 10:59 pm

Maybe Dr Judy Wood is being paid by the US government to discredit the conspiracy theorists?! :o :o :o
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