The jab ..

[dans6490]

PS.

If the government can't even protect the old in the care homes by simply having live in careers rather than letting individual support workers bounce from one site to 4-5 others on a daily basis passing the virus out amongst the worst affected. Having 12 months ago sent infected people back from the hospital into the care homes.

If that's the way they are treating them- what makes you think they they know what's right for you and your family? And why should you listen to them and obey their "science".

Totally agree with the care home situation, however, I think it was lose/lose situation and I don’t see how it’s the governments fault. Most care homes are private businesses that make their own decisions. The problem is there are very few of these people that you mention, usually with families, that are willing to forfeit large parts of their lives, working for little over the minimum wage? I doubt you’d get many signing up for that

I hear everyone blaming the government, for everything, on a daily basis.

However, no mass blame for those ignoring the advice. Of course, as you say above, they know better then the scientific advisors? Like the hundreds attending weddings, parties etc. They also know something the government advisors don’t

Yeah sure the government made mistakes and some of the public are able to make rational choices that bend the rules while staying safe. However, I believe that most people think they’re experts and don’t “obey” their science. There’s an awful lot of the population of very low intelligence out there doing just that. Which I believe is why we are in this exact situation.

Fortunately we don’t live in China and people / businesses are given the advice and asked to obey the rules. The trade off is that people who don’t want to follow the advice, will face little sanctions. Those people who know better are packing out the shops up and down the country

I can’t get a definitive answer in this but is it really “the government” who were sending oap’s back to care homes? Was it “the government” who decided who was well enough to be discharged or was it the nhs staff who work in the hospitals?

When these elderly patients are well enough to go back to the care homes, what should they do with them? Keep them in the very place that definitely does have Covid 19, which takes up a much needed bed? Or send them back to a care home and allow the care staff to continue doing their best to keep them safe?

A work colleague was telling me the other day, that if Labour had been voted in, we would have had a different set of advisors, civil servants, council workers, that would have made better choices. Not just MP’s but the people up and down the country who work for the council or government departments etc. Like local planning, health and safety, etc. They would all be replaced by people in the Labour Party.

Yes there are people out there who are genuinely that naive, that they believe that when a government changes, the people in all of those jobs also change

These people are all around us disobeying the rules and spreading the virus at will

IMO these people are the ones mainly at fault.

[TitanTim]

Completely agree with Dan above, we have never been in this situation before so tricky for any Government to tackle it to please all.

I do believe though the Government acted slow at times in introducing fuller lockdowns sooner, i.e. back in November than waiting then relaxing things over Christmas with the enivetable results.

I just don't think us Brits are very good at following rules, many do but many have the I know better, stuff you, selfish attitude, plus its scary how many people are simply not very intelligent. I heard a story locally where a chap was telling the check out girl at his local supermarket that he had come shopping on his own as his wife was self isolating

What can one say.

Tim.

[Z4C_er]

Apparently this vaccine has shown a 67% mean rate of blocking transmission. With those odds the R number will fall quickly the more people are vaccinated.

Well that's the thing isn't it.

In an ideal situation alongside the effectiveness of the people who have already had the virus (not mentioned no where near enough but we have a year's worth of data now to see if they can transmit again) the jabbers will bring that R rate down.

At this point it will either A, die out as people are just not catching it as there is a barrier with herd immunity. Or B, will keep burning through the young who are least at risk and build towards the herd immunity.

Either way, this is only heading one way now and that's in a positive direction. I think it will take longer than normal to get back to where we need to be but as far as I am concerned as soon as my parents get their second jab and their 90% as a family I would have thought we will make the decision to go back to normal.

We Lanes are capable of thinking for ourselves and are aware of the risks and the government can spin it any way they want but I would have thought most free thinking people are the same.

Lives are there to be lived. If you have your jab and get your 95+% protection from a virus that you have 99.9% survival rate from and still at that point think we should close businesses, destroy kids futures and rack up unprecedented amounts of debt then I don't really know what to say what to say about it really.

The good times are just around the corner (once we negate the mass unemployment, poverty and the destruction of lives that we have caused over the last year).

Here's another one of those quote who didn't say it things. Something screwy is going on here. I couldn't see how you could quote me is I wasn't involved in the original response? It was a Prof response to Titan Tim. What's going on mods?

[dans6490]

Apparently this vaccine has shown a 67% mean rate of blocking transmission. With those odds the R number will fall quickly the more people are vaccinated.

Well that's the thing isn't it.

In an ideal situation alongside the effectiveness of the people who have already had the virus (not mentioned no where near enough but we have a year's worth of data now to see if they can transmit again) the jabbers will bring that R rate down.

At this point it will either A, die out as people are just not catching it as there is a barrier with herd immunity. Or B, will keep burning through the young who are least at risk and build towards the herd immunity.

Either way, this is only heading one way now and that's in a positive direction. I think it will take longer than normal to get back to where we need to be but as far as I am concerned as soon as my parents get their second jab and their 90% as a family I would have thought we will make the decision to go back to normal.

We Lanes are capable of thinking for ourselves and are aware of the risks and the government can spin it any way they want but I would have thought most free thinking people are the same.

Lives are there to be lived. If you have your jab and get your 95+% protection from a virus that you have 99.9% survival rate from and still at that point think we should close businesses, destroy kids futures and rack up unprecedented amounts of debt then I don't really know what to say what to say about it really.

The good times are just around the corner (once we negate the mass unemployment, poverty and the destruction of lives that we have caused over the last year).

Here's another one of those quote who didn't say it things. Something screwy is going on here. I couldn't see how you could quote me is I wasn't involved in the original response? It was a Prof response to Titan Tim. What's going on mods?

Wow, that is weird. How is that even possible

[dans6490]

Well that's the thing isn't it.

In an ideal situation alongside the effectiveness of the people who have already had the virus (not mentioned no where near enough but we have a year's worth of data now to see if they can transmit again) the jabbers will bring that R rate down.

At this point it will either A, die out as people are just not catching it as there is a barrier with herd immunity. Or B, will keep burning through the young who are least at risk and build towards the herd immunity.

Either way, this is only heading one way now and that's in a positive direction. I think it will take longer than normal to get back to where we need to be but as far as I am concerned as soon as my parents get their second jab and their 90% as a family I would have thought we will make the decision to go back to normal.

We Lanes are capable of thinking for ourselves and are aware of the risks and the government can spin it any way they want but I would have thought most free thinking people are the same.

Lives are there to be lived. If you have your jab and get your 95+% protection from a virus that you have 99.9% survival rate from and still at that point think we should close businesses, destroy kids futures and rack up unprecedented amounts of debt then I don't really know what to say what to say about it really.

The good times are just around the corner (once we negate the mass unemployment, poverty and the destruction of lives that we have caused over the last year).

Here's another one of those quote who didn't say it things. Something screwy is going on here. I couldn't see how you could quote me is I wasn't involved in the original response? It was a Prof response to Titan Tim. What's going on mods?

Wow, that is weird. How is that even possible

Mmmmmm it seems you can edit the name when quoting

[Smartbear]

Here's another one of those quote who didn't say it things. Something screwy is going on here. I couldn't see how you could quote me is I wasn't involved in the original response? It was a Prof response to Titan Tim. What's going on mods?

Wow, that is weird. How is that even possible

Mmmmmm it seems you can edit the name when quoting

Not another conspiracy theory, please.
Rob

[Nictrix]

Yes there are people out there who are genuinely that naive, that they believe that when a government changes, the people in all of those jobs also change

I must be naive but is this not exactly what happens?
Whatever government is in charge chooses who they deal with and each will have their own "experts" who they will work with.

[dans6490]

Wow, that is weird. How is that even possible

Mmmmmm it seems you can edit the name when quoting

Not another conspiracy theory, please.
Rob

Your name is DarthVader????

[dans6490]

Yes there are people out there who are genuinely that naive, that they believe that when a government changes, the people in all of those jobs also change

I must be naive but is this not exactly what happens?
Whatever government is in charge chooses who they deal with and each will have their own "experts" who they will work with.

So if Labour got in power, the people who cut the grass, empty the bins, oversee local planning, visit restaurants to check if they are hygienic, deal with fly tipping, work in the office that deal with council tax etc, all lose their jobs and are replaced by thousands of people who the new government then employ.........err no

[Nictrix]

So if Labour got in power, the people who cut the grass, empty the bins, oversee local planning, visit restaurants to check if they are hygienic, deal with fly tipping, work in the office that deal with council tax etc, all lose their jobs and are replaced by thousands of people who the new government then employ.........err no


Yes there are people out there who are genuinely that naive, that they believe that when a government changes, the people in all of those jobs also change

I must be naive but is this not exactly what happens?
Whatever government is in charge chooses who they deal with and each will have their own "experts" who they will work with.

No, not all of those types of people, but you could probably bet that if any of the other parties were in power it wouldnt be people like Chris Whitty that would be paraded in front of the cameras.
For instance Chris Whitty was given the role of chief medical officer by the current government.
Im sure every other party would choose their own person to fill the same role.

[dans6490]

I must be naive but is this not exactly what happens?
Whatever government is in charge chooses who they deal with and each will have their own "experts" who they will work with.

No, not all of those types of people, but you could probably bet that if any of the other parties were in power it wouldnt be people like Chris Whitty that would be paraded in front of the cameras.
For instance Chris Whitty was given the role of chief medical officer by the current government.
Im sure every other party would choose their own person to fill the same role.

Sorry, agreed, in that instance. This chap was referring to our local council and how they weren’t answering phones quickly, delayed bin collections etc. He was under the impression that if Labour got in, they would all be out of a job, to be replaced by Labours employees

[Nictrix]

No, not all of those types of people, but you could probably bet that if any of the other parties were in power it wouldnt be people like Chris Whitty that would be paraded in front of the cameras.
For instance Chris Whitty was given the role of chief medical officer by the current government.
Im sure every other party would choose their own person to fill the same role.

Sorry, agreed, in that instance. This chap was referring to our local council and how they weren’t answering phones quickly, delayed bin collections etc. He was under the impression that if Labour got in, they would all be out of a job, to be replaced by Labours employees

And with that being agreed it makes you think that the chief medical officer would possibly be shooting himself in the foot by not towing the line with anything the government says.
Makes you wonder.......

[dans6490]

No, not all of those types of people, but you could probably bet that if any of the other parties were in power it wouldnt be people like Chris Whitty that would be paraded in front of the cameras.
For instance Chris Whitty was given the role of chief medical officer by the current government.
Im sure every other party would choose their own person to fill the same role.

Sorry, agreed, in that instance. This chap was referring to our local council and how they weren’t answering phones quickly, delayed bin collections etc. He was under the impression that if Labour got in, they would all be out of a job, to be replaced by Labours employees

And with that being agreed it makes you think that the chief medical officer would possibly be shooting himself in the foot by not towing the line with anything the government says.
Makes you wonder.......

Again agreed

[john-e89]

I don’t think Chris Whitty needs to worry about getting or keeping a job....

This is getting silly beyond silly...

[Nanu]

Patients were sent back to care homes yes. They were sent to those which had the facility to quarantine them from the rest of the care home community and these were given additional funding. The issue was as you say was with staff, in particular nurses, who bounced from one car home to another. It is a legal duty for these places to have a qualified nurse on duty at all times. This was often fulfilled by NHS nurses working additional shifts or agency staff covering more than one home. I suspect that when we have the inevitable enquiry into Covid, the one main outcome will be that our wonderful NHS staff were all not quite as wonderful as we are led to believe.