Soft top stuck down after winter hardtop removal

williamdefender · Post by **williamdefender** » Wed Mar 21, 2018 10:48 pm

Found a very useful video . 10 mins 30 secs in shows where to drill hole for relocation of pipes into the boot . Someone else might find this useful if reading this thread at a later date
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VH9H-j3RKac&frags=wn

williamdefender · Post by **williamdefender** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 3:50 pm

guys please help . Im at the give up stage ...
Ive removed the soft top and have it on the garage floor
connected the lines and ran straight to a good battery .
No movement in the roof and I'm started to think i may have the line mixed up . Can anyone help here , the numbers have rubbed off but 12 and 14 are still visible . Should the two lines from each ram run to one side of the pump . i.e if I'm looking at the pump the left hole should the two lines from it run to one ram . Is there a picture anywhere . Motor spins and if i back go the lines at the pump i get a flow of oil out of the hole and if i reverse power i get a flow oaf oil out of the other hole . Flipping had the roof in thinking i had it sorted and have now had to pull it out again . What other tests should i do . Please help , thanks

williamdefender · Post by **williamdefender** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 4:07 pm

guys if you could confirm the lines please , that would be of good help .

: lines.png (786.69 KiB) Viewed 934 times

This was my before picture . Does 11 and 13 go to the same same ram and 12 and 14 go to the same ram .

passenger side ram , which line goes to top of the ram and which to the bottom
driver side ram ram , which line goes to the top of the ram and which to the bottom

thanks

firebobby · Post by **firebobby** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 4:17 pm

I'm amazed you haven't had the roof boys all over this thread, they are usually very helpful in these matters. I'm sure there are threads on the forum showing the pipes into the motor. Really sorry I can't help as I have never touched my roof motor.

williamdefender · Post by **williamdefender** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 7:46 pm

Ok I'm pretty sure i have the lines going to the right place . Im not seeing any leaks and if i disconnect the lines at the pump and move the roof manually then the oil squirks out of the banjo ends which makes me think the rams are ok . I have also ran the pump without lines attached and found that there is a flow of oil and it moves onto the other port if i reverse the polarity . Question is should i be getting a good flow , i mean it only kinds drips out . certainly no real pressure coming out of the oil ports . If i split the motor then the dc motor spins fast and free . Im starting to think i should get a good pump out of the oil ports . I may be looking at getting the hydraulic part of the motor replaced .

Smartbear · Post by **Smartbear** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:01 pm

williamdefender wrote: ↑Sun Mar 25, 2018 7:46 pm Ok I'm pretty sure i have the lines going to the right place . Im not seeing any leaks and if i disconnect the lines at the pump and move the roof manually then the oil squirks out of the banjo ends which makes me think the rams are ok . I have also ran the pump without lines attached and found that there is a flow of oil and it moves onto the other port if i reverse the polarity . Question is should i be getting a good flow , i mean it only kinds drips out . certainly no real pressure coming out of the oil ports . If i split the motor then the dc motor spins fast and free . Im starting to think i should get a good pump out of the oil ports . I may be looking at getting the hydraulic part of the motor replaced .

If you previously used the roof manually, have you reseated the bypass valve?
Rob

williamdefender · Post by **williamdefender** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:40 pm

Aye the bypass valve was stuck in ( the wee brass bit on the side ) . I got it moving in and out with wd40 and it seems to be working ok . Maybe its half in or something , can't be sure having never worked on one . Thats why I'm interested in what kind of flow of oil i should get out of the ports . If i disconnect the line at the ram then all i get is a dribble of oil coming out . Just doesn't seem enough to get it moving . Reakon its time to get a motor . Good thing though is I'm learning . Had the roof out today in 40mins and reakon i can have her back in the same time .

firebobby · Post by **firebobby** » Sun Mar 25, 2018 9:08 pm

Good on you, when you get it sorted, you could be the NI roof guru

Jas- USA · Post by **Jas- USA** » Mon Mar 26, 2018 2:04 am

Ok, the lines in the above picture. The lines on the right bolt should be the short lines and run to your passenger side/Driver side for USA cars. Whereas, the lines on the left bolt should run to the drivers side (long lines) English model/passenger side USA model.

If you have no leaks and when you remove the lines the pump only runs weakly. It's one of two things Pump related.
One. The emergency release ball bearing is still half frozen blocking the hydo flow. There is a cut out Troxes screw on the other side of the pump body. Remove this cutout screw. You'll see a spring...remove it. Now you'll see the other side of the ball bearing ....try working it (freeing it). Put it back together and see if it now works.

Two the pump itself has failed for reasons unknown......so if #1 doesn't do it and your sure the lifter pumps aren't leaking. you'll need a new motor.

Hope this helps

John...from across the pond.

williamdefender · Post by **williamdefender** » Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:00 pm

Excellent advice John. Many thanks for your support with this .

Ducklakeview · Post by **Ducklakeview** » Mon Mar 26, 2018 2:13 pm

Jas- USA wrote: ↑Mon Mar 26, 2018 2:04 am Ok, the lines in the above picture. The lines on the right bolt should be the short lines and run to your passenger side/Driver side for USA cars. Whereas, the lines on the left bolt should run to the drivers side (long lines) English model/passenger side USA model.

Sorry, that's wrong. Driving at mo. Will pm op my number

Mike

williamdefender · Post by **williamdefender** » Mon Mar 26, 2018 5:00 pm

Thats brill , the real oem threw me
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/showpar ... Id=54_0313

However i received this info which i believe is correct
11 LHS lower (plate connection).
13 RHS lower (plate connection).

12 LHS upper (clip connection).
14 RHS upper (clip connection).

So 11 & 13 are joined together at the pump and 12 & 14 are joined in the same way.

That is the way i had it connected so i have a replacement pump on route . Shall keep the thread updated . Thanks again all

Hagasan · Post by **Hagasan** » Mon Mar 26, 2018 6:13 pm

Just a quick message..

Did you clean up the motor ie bath it in diesel and running for about 20 mins in each direction? I mentioned this in an earlier post.
The motor rarely fail to the point of not being revivable.
Did you top up the the hydraulic fluid after removing the pipes to the required level?
When you refitted did you manually raise and lower the roof a few times to bleed the system?
You may well be getting a replacement pump for no reason.
I've done this job so can speak from experience rather than guesswork.

williamdefender · Post by **williamdefender** » Mon Mar 26, 2018 8:18 pm

hagasan wrote: ↑Mon Mar 26, 2018 6:13 pm just a quick message..

did you clean up the motor ie bath it in diesel and running for about 20 mins in each direction? i mentioned this in an earlier post.

i left it in diesel overnight and ran it as described . it runs free in both directions .

the motor rarely fail to the point of not being revivable.
did you top up the the hydraulic fluid after removing the pipes to the required level?
yes, many times

when you refitted did you manually raise and lower the roof a few times to bleed the system?
yes and also when lines where disconnected from motor it forced oil back out of the banjo connections , proving i believe the lines and rams

you may well be getting a replacement pump for no reason.
i hope not but i was left will no choice , i wasnt sure if the flow was correct and had to take a punt . It is a dribble out of the ports and im thinking that is the root of the problem .

i've done this job so can speak from experience rather than guesswork.
Pity you didnt live closer , im afraid i dont have any z4 fans in the nearby area so im having to fly solo .

best case i can hope for is that the new motor works and i can regain some money back for my old one . Also theres the learning aspect which i will take away from this experiance and perhaps be able to help someone local .
Im sure that this thread along with the other numerous roof threads will all add to the community on here .

thanks

Jas- USA · Post by **Jas- USA** » Mon Mar 26, 2018 8:43 pm

Hey Guy

I changed out my motor using ducklakeview and the German guy's method of thru the trunk ( I was screwed & had to do it this way because my emergency cable had also failed). However, I already had a new motor. It worked & I installed the hydo line one bolt set at a time. However, doing the trunk install one of my hydo lines had failed (most likely was on the way out already). Anyway, even with new motor top wasn't moving but...I was losing Hydo fluid. After tracing the leak (thank god it wasn't a lifter) I found that the drivers side (USA) lower lifter line was leaking. Ducklakeview attempt to help me using a thru the trunk change out of the line .....However, you can't transmit talent by word and he and the guy in Germany can pull off changing lines theu the trunk. In that, there are a lot of Medical Doctors but, not so many surgeons.
Anyway, I don't know the lines by numbers (I actually didn't need that info) but, from physically tracing then for the leak I know which line from the pump goes to which lifter.

However, this is a section of the BMW Z4 shop repair manual which covers repairs to hydo lines and it has your Line # info.

https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/e85- ... op/Bq9DfKV

Z4-forum.com

Z4-forum.com