7 Vs 1

Specific discussion about the E89 2009 Z4 (sDrive35is, sDrive35i, sDrive30i, sDrive23i)
User avatar
mr.tourette
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 2002
Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2015 9:16 am
Location: north wales

7 Vs 1

Post by mr.tourette » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:36 pm

either way they are being very shady not admitting theyre in the wrong when you have it in black andwhite. Id be tempted to contact the AA too and ask what they think of a garage they approve behaving in this way should you wish to persue of course
if its got tits or tyres..its trouble :D

Oliver Ciaravella
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2020 10:30 pm

7 Vs 1

Post by Oliver Ciaravella » Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:51 pm

mr.tourette wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:34 pm did you run an hpi check?
No as it was sold via an AA dealer and they state that any issues on HPI check would be highlighted and informed
2012 - BMW Z4 - 20in Wheels - Red Leather
Image

Zikim
Member
Member
Posts: 622
Joined: Mon Jun 02, 2014 6:49 pm

7 Vs 1

Post by Zikim » Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:10 pm

Oliver Ciaravella wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:51 pm
mr.tourette wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:34 pm did you run an hpi check?
No as it was sold via an AA dealer and they state that any issues on HPI check would be highlighted and informed
Unfortunately 7 owners on a car is not a HPI issue.

How much do you reckon that you overpaid for it being only 1 owner against how much for 7 owners?

Oliver Ciaravella
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2020 10:30 pm

7 Vs 1

Post by Oliver Ciaravella » Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:13 pm

Zikim wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:10 pm
Oliver Ciaravella wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:51 pm
mr.tourette wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:34 pm did you run an hpi check?
No as it was sold via an AA dealer and they state that any issues on HPI check would be highlighted and informed
Unfortunately 7 owners on a car is not a HPI issue.

How much do you reckon that you overpaid for it being only 1 owner against how much for 7 owners?
I am getting a local garage to do a valuation but he reckons somewhere between 500-1000.

I’m not really that worried about the value as such it’s more the fact that if I were to sell it I would likely have to drop by that amount when number of owners is shared
2012 - BMW Z4 - 20in Wheels - Red Leather
Image

User avatar
Zed Baron
Member
Member
Posts: 585
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2018 1:17 am
Location: Scotland

7 Vs 1

Post by Zed Baron » Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:19 pm

Oliver Ciaravella wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:27 pm
Zed Baron wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 5:29 pm Did you ask to see the V5 before you purchased it?
No I didn’t, due to Covid it was purchased at distance with 20% deposit and transfer was registered online
Good luck, I hope you get it resolved, mistakes happen. Just out of interest how long have you had the car now? "Under the Consumer Rights Act 2015, this car should be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. Your rights have been breached because the car they sold you is faulty/doesn’t match the description". Citizens Advice Service
Image

Zikim
Member
Member
Posts: 622
Joined: Mon Jun 02, 2014 6:49 pm

7 Vs 1

Post by Zikim » Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:29 pm

Oliver Ciaravella wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:13 pm
Zikim wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:10 pm
Oliver Ciaravella wrote: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:51 pm No as it was sold via an AA dealer and they state that any issues on HPI check would be highlighted and informed
Unfortunately 7 owners on a car is not a HPI issue.

How much do you reckon that you overpaid for it being only 1 owner against how much for 7 owners?
I am getting a local garage to do a valuation but he reckons somewhere between 500-1000.

I’m not really that worried about the value as such it’s more the fact that if I were to sell it I would likely have to drop by that amount when number of owners is shared
As a rough guide using webuyanycar a 2012 2.0 Z4 with 50,000 miles with only 1 owner is only £140 more in value than the same car with 5+ owners.

The value is usually based on mileage and condition more than the number of owners. Stop agonising over it and start enjoying your zed.

User avatar
BMWZ4MC
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 5797
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2009 4:24 pm
Location: Back in the sunshine

7 Vs 1

Post by BMWZ4MC » Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:26 pm

They’ve overtly stated it’s a one owner car and you have proof of that. When you challenged them about it, effectively they told you to get stuffed.
I would write to them and give them a seven day deadline to reply explaining why they mislead you and what they will do to make amends. If you get no joy, I would report the situation to the AA and ask them if they feel they have been favourably represented by this garage and what they plan to do to correct the situation to your satisfaction, as well as to sanction the dealer in question.
Legal action should be the last resort. However, this was a deliberate fraudulent act on the part of the dealer and, as a matter of principle, I wouldn’t take it lying down no matter how much you like the car.
Image
Z4MC - heavily fettled for track use, now in Sydney; Modified RS4 Avant - back in Blighty;
Westfield SEiW track car currently in hibernation; S2000 GT - sold

3.0Rich
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2020 9:19 pm

7 Vs 1

Post by 3.0Rich » Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:48 pm

I had a similar choice with mine. Sold as a 1 owner but when log book arrived it was 7. There was also a small crease in the bonnet in a place where i couldn't not see it.
Dealer not interested in the crease or number of owners until I sent an email hinting I'd be bringing car back within 1st 30 days because of mis-selling.
He then paid for Dentdaddy of Peterborough to fix the crease at my home which he did, perfect, can't see any sign of it.
My take on it is what do I do if car went back? I love the car, it's stunning to look at and brilliant to drive. Very low mileage and like new inside etc. Looking at the market it looks like I could get my money back at the moment but the only alternative for me is a Boxster and I'm not sure, having already had one, I'd want to have to choose one over my Z4.
My plan is to enjoy driving/owning my car, especially once I get rid of that ridiculous clutch delay..... :headbang:

Oliver Ciaravella
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2020 10:30 pm

7 Vs 1

Post by Oliver Ciaravella » Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:51 pm

Hi All

So the update from the dealer.

They have not taken any responsibility saying that the cars only show numbers of owners once a car is sold and that it defaults to 1 owner. This is not the case as other sold cars had 2,3 4 + owners.

The dealer has now removed all previous owners from all current cars and all sold cars.

They then responded by stating that they will fight this and claim back costs, now my understanding is that in the small claims court there can’t be claims for costs made if I lost.

I suggested an offer of 250-500 which would cover any issues when it comes to selling but would also allow me replace some of the seals. I have not heard back yet but thought thus was a reasonable offer.

I have also contacted The AA to ask them to step in.

Let’s see what happens now. To be honest I would not have pursued this had the dealer said look we made a mistake we apologise here’s 50-100 goodwill. It’s not ultimately due to the money as tbh the difference is minimal it’s more about the dealers dishonesty.
2012 - BMW Z4 - 20in Wheels - Red Leather
Image

Jasonn
Member
Member
Posts: 172
Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2019 10:38 pm

7 Vs 1

Post by Jasonn » Thu Sep 17, 2020 10:35 pm

You can't claim for legal expenses in the small claims court (sometimes called "fast track") - a few years ago someone tried to sue my wife, spoke to a friend who is a solicitor who said that we should lodge a counter claim (which we did) but we were worried about getting rinsed so wanted representation, solicitor kept advising us that we wouldn't get the costs back and that it would probably cancel out what we'd win anyway.

He did a bit of ringing around and had a "pupil" barrister who he got to represent us just so that he could get the experience.

Long story short, court found in our favour, the a**ehole didn't pay up - wasn't worth the effort in pursuing it further. Solicitor only charged us for the pupil barrister's expenses. Just be aware that might be something they could try, although once it is heard in court it becomes public, so might shame them

Silverstar
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 1326
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:06 am
Location: Costa Del Sol

7 Vs 1

Post by Silverstar » Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:51 am

The dealer is clearly in the wrong, if he has written 1 owner in his web listing and the fact that the car has more means he is in breach. As you say due to his attitude I would fight it as a matter of principle.

More than likely you will win the case should it go to court. Make sure you keep all the evidence that shows that he listed the car as 1 owner. From my understanding about small claims is if you have a solicitor represent you, you cannot get back his legal fees but if you represent yourself you can claim for the court costs i.e. what it cost you to start the claim and also interest.

The interesting thing here is if this claim qualifies for small claims, there used to be a claim limit of £5000 if I remember correctly but not sure what it might be now. In this case if you can claim just for the amount of compensation you want say e.g. £500 then yes you can claim via small claims but if the claim has to be for the whole amount paid for the car then it's a different ball game.

Earlier on I said that if the car was ok and you like it and you didn't pay a huge premium due to it being a 1 owner, not to waste time for a couple of hundred quid but given the attitude of this dealer I think I would do it just out of a matter of principle.
2009 sdrive30i auto Sapphire Black / Coral Red

Silverstar
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 1326
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:06 am
Location: Costa Del Sol

7 Vs 1

Post by Silverstar » Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:55 am

One other thing quite often people / companies try to bluff their way out. I had this with an insurance company, ironically for mechanical breakdown insurance for my old E30 despite their assessors report stating the damage to the engine was due to mechanical failure and not wear and tear they refused to pay up. So I sent them a copy of the court summons that I was about to file and voila they came back with an offer!
2009 sdrive30i auto Sapphire Black / Coral Red

Oliver Ciaravella
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2020 10:30 pm

7 Vs 1

Post by Oliver Ciaravella » Sat Sep 19, 2020 8:28 pm

Hi All

Just to update.

I filed a claim via small claims court for £500 plus £35 fees and advised garage.

They have advised me that they are particularly annoyed as the issue was caused by their website provider and not as a result of mis representation.

I do accept this was the case and have said if they wish to settle out of court then I will accept the full claim amount.

The garage owner also advised he was out celebrating his 50th, too much information but hey ho
2012 - BMW Z4 - 20in Wheels - Red Leather
Image

User avatar
GJ1
Member
Member
Posts: 89
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 10:07 pm

7 Vs 1

Post by GJ1 » Sat Sep 19, 2020 8:38 pm

I think your actions are completely reasonable (if not generous). It appears that it was a simple mistake but it was not your mistake so hopefully the matter is resolved quickly and you can spend the money on your car...I'm sure you'll find lots of things to spend your money on after reading the numerous posts in this forum!
07 Z4C 3.0si sport sapphire black

BadgerDog
Member
Member
Posts: 85
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2020 12:26 am

7 Vs 1

Post by BadgerDog » Sun Sep 20, 2020 3:23 am

Oliver Ciaravella wrote: Sat Sep 19, 2020 8:28 pm They have advised me that they are particularly annoyed as the issue was caused by their website provider and not as a result of mis representation.
Well thats a shame now isnt it? But... remind me again... how is that your fault OR problem? They need to take ownership of their problem and make it right... then go after the website provider if they are really the ones who screwed up... not expect the buyer to deal with the problem. Jerks.

Post Reply