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Non fault accident - help?

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AndyBeech
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Non fault accident - help?

Post by AndyBeech » Tue May 22, 2018 8:49 pm

ph001 wrote: Tue May 22, 2018 8:33 pm I’m still unclear. I have a feeling that accidental damage to other people’s property is a civil offence, not a criminal one. In which case you would just claim for damages in the small claims court. The fact that they have insurance is just protection for them for exactly these kind of circumstances.

Totally different scenario but a dog owner was walking her dog on a public footpath behind our house off the lead. The dog spotted our cat in our garden, bolted in and savagely killed our cat. We wete advised that it merely constituted damage to our ‘property’ and hence was a civil matter.
The offence is not stopping to give your details or if that is not reasonably possible, reporting to a police station.
There is no offence for the damage caused, that’s the civil part.

Just to add, there wouldn’t be a defence available to the driver as the OP says witnesses tried to stop him driving away. The main defence is if it’s deemed the driver could not have been aware any damage was caused or did not believe he had been involved in an accident (if reversing for example and didn’t realise contact with a vehicle or person had been made).
Last edited by AndyBeech on Tue May 22, 2018 9:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Non fault accident - help?

Post by Darkangelv2 » Tue May 22, 2018 8:59 pm

ShineyT wrote: Tue May 22, 2018 7:27 pm Got a crime reference number, do you have any idea where I can get insurer details?

I have the reg and car details.
This situation absolutely sucks!!

Can you let us know your insurance company as id like to blacklist from my future selection. They sound awful!
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Non fault accident - help?

Post by ph001 » Tue May 22, 2018 9:00 pm

Yep, Andybeech has it right...

“The Road Traffic Act

Under the Road Traffic Act (1988) the rules are simple.

If you’re driving a motorised vehicle and are involved in an accident which causes damage or injury to another person, vehicle, property or animal, (including dogs, horses, cattle and sheep), you must stop and give your vehicle registration along with your name and address to “anyone with reasonable grounds to be asking for those details”.

In most cases this will be the other driver. And if you’re not the vehicle owner, you should hand over the vehicle owner’s details too.

“If you don’t exchange details at the scene, you must report the incident to the police within 24 hours”, says motoring lawyer Alison Ashworth from Ashworth Motoring Law. ”
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Non fault accident - help?

Post by Crazy Harry » Tue May 22, 2018 9:04 pm

Didn't Mike DLV trace a women that drove into his Zed in a car park earlier this year - he only had a car reg to go on so how did he do it?

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Non fault accident - help?

Post by ShineyT » Tue May 22, 2018 9:14 pm

Darkangelv2 wrote: Tue May 22, 2018 8:59 pm
ShineyT wrote: Tue May 22, 2018 7:27 pm Got a crime reference number, do you have any idea where I can get insurer details?

I have the reg and car details.
This situation absolutely sucks!!

Can you let us know your insurance company as id like to blacklist from my future selection. They sound awful!
I wasn’t going to as prepared to give them a slight further chance to resolve this in a better way. Let’s say it’s a huge company in the sector and a market leader.

They have confirmed other car is insured and they have contacted their insurer to admit involvement (note: not liability). Something that was said on the phone does give me a hunch that my insurer is representing both parties....

To answer everyone else, thanks for the advice etc but still not sure how I get this resolved the way I want it to be short of paying for the repair myself which will be steeep.

I really don’t want to use an AMC but if anyone has a recommendation...
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Non fault accident - help?

Post by AndyBeech » Tue May 22, 2018 9:19 pm

ShineyT wrote: Tue May 22, 2018 9:14 pm
Darkangelv2 wrote: Tue May 22, 2018 8:59 pm
ShineyT wrote: Tue May 22, 2018 7:27 pm Got a crime reference number, do you have any idea where I can get insurer details?

I have the reg and car details.
This situation absolutely sucks!!

Can you let us know your insurance company as id like to blacklist from my future selection. They sound awful!
I wasn’t going to as prepared to give them a slight further chance to resolve this in a better way. Let’s say it’s a huge company in the sector and a market leader.

To answer everyone else, thanks for the advice etc but still not sure how I get this resolved the way I want it to be short of paying for the repair myself which will be steeep.

I really don’t want to use an AMC but if anyone has a recommendation...
I would argue your case with the police personally and then go from there, give them all the details you have and demand an offence has been committed
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Non fault accident - help?

Post by Mr Tidy » Tue May 22, 2018 9:19 pm

The firm I used was called Swift Hire.

Phone: 0845 402 9967
Web: www.swiftprestigehire.com

And was very pleased with the outcome, but that was in 2009! Others may have more recent experience.
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Non fault accident - help?

Post by Crazy Harry » Tue May 22, 2018 9:34 pm

Crazy Harry wrote: Tue May 22, 2018 9:04 pm Didn't Mike DLV trace a women that drove into his Zed in a car park earlier this year - he only had a car reg to go on so how did he do it?
Found the thread: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=104358&start=45

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Non fault accident - help?

Post by mjennings23 » Tue May 22, 2018 10:11 pm

https://www.mib.org.uk/check-insurance- ... -accident/

Costs £4, and you get their policy number and insurance company contact details. This will, however, flag your car as having been involved in an accident and therefore need to be disclosed on future insurance renewals (but I'm sure you're expecting that anyway).

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Non fault accident - help?

Post by Usel » Tue May 22, 2018 11:48 pm

mjennings23 wrote: Tue May 22, 2018 10:11 pm https://www.mib.org.uk/check-insurance- ... -accident/

Costs £4, and you get their policy number and insurance company contact details. This will, however, flag your car as having been involved in an accident and therefore need to be disclosed on future insurance renewals (but I'm sure you're expecting that anyway).
Do this and then contact their insurance company direct. Just notify your insurance company that your car was hit but dont progress any further with them.
Make your claim only through their insurance, you can get the car repaired anywhere you want, I'd go through bmw, you dont have to use anyone they suggest but you may have to get more than one quote for the repairs.
If your not happy then tell them your going to claim through an accident management company.

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Non fault accident - help?

Post by Davz » Tue May 22, 2018 11:57 pm

ShineyT wrote: Tue May 22, 2018 7:19 pm After some advice having had someone drive in to my car (parked outside my house on shared drive)
as you were not on the public highway but on privately owned land this is a civil matter, hence why the police are not interested.

Regarding your insurance company "They will only entertain repairing the car at a Vauxhall dealer as that is their approved." They have no right in law to dictate to you where you have your car repaired or what parts are used. You have every right to choose where to have your car repaired, however the insurance company then have the right to refuse to guarantee the repairs, as you have not used an approved repairer. Therefore if 13 months down the line and the bodywork starts corroding you will be on your own, where as the insurer would ensure that or anything else would be put right usually within a 3yr time span.

I personally never use the approved repairer as they have to do the job at a low cost to keep their contract with the insurance company, which ensures regular work. The last time I claimed I was told that I had to take my car to Birmingham, over an hours drive, with them insisting I take it there. I told them I knew my rights and it was going to a local bodyshop, they then gave me the scare story of no guarantee. I am fortunate that I use Enterprise in Telford who have a superb reputation with show car standard paintwork, If you know of a high quality bodyshop use them, they will only use oem parts.

If your insurer is the insurer for both cars I would have thought the threat of an accident management company will make them capitulate and seek redress from the guilty party, or they would have to pay the fees of the AMC. If not use the AMC.
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Non fault accident - help?

Post by Mr Tidy » Wed May 23, 2018 12:06 am

Usel wrote: Tue May 22, 2018 11:48 pm Do this and then contact their insurance company direct. Just notify your insurance company that your car was hit but dont progress any further with them.
Make your claim only through their insurance, you can get the car repaired anywhere you want, I'd go through bmw, you dont have to use anyone they suggest but you may have to get more than one quote for the repairs.
If your not happy then tell them your going to claim through an accident management company.
I agree with most of this, but DON'T tell your insurer if you go down this route - they'll post an outstanding claim on your policy which has the potential to be a major PITA!

Ideally you want it all settled as a non-fault claim before you get your renewal because you have no duty of disclosure until renewal on an annual insurance contract.

Your insurer will never pay the AMC fees which is why the AMC will never claim from your insurer, only from the insurer of the guilty party (or tort-feasor in legalese)! :)
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Non fault accident - help?

Post by ph001 » Wed May 23, 2018 5:21 am

Someone ran into the back of my wifes car 2yrs ago so was recorded as a non-fault claim. Note, this was a claim on the other drivers policy NOT hers.

Pretty dismayed then to find her premium went up by a £120 the following year because of it. Pretty outrageous really.

It was recorded on the insurance db so no way you could get away with no declaring it. You have to notify of ALL accidents.
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Non fault accident - help?

Post by Monkeydonkeyratmagic » Wed May 23, 2018 6:51 am

Get an accident management company involved. They'll pay dvla £20 for his address and then get them to court him for the full value of the repair a d they can pursue costs from the offender.
Under simple tort of negligence a magistrate would simply run a "reasonable person test" and simply put award you the full costs. but be QUICK if you get to his place ASAFUCKINGP before damage is masked his end. If you find his car and see it's damaged, take photos and win win.
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Non fault accident - help?

Post by raymond.harper » Wed May 23, 2018 8:10 am

I have used accident management companies twice in the past 15 years. In both cases I did not have to do a thing. You have a witness to the damage which makes all the difference in these claims.

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