Not joined yet? Register for free and enjoy features such as alerts, private messaging and viewing latest posts and topics.

Remapping

2003 - 2009, roadster, coupe, facelift
eddiemunster
Member
Member
Posts: 278
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:37 pm

Remapping

Post by eddiemunster » Thu Feb 22, 2018 6:51 pm

I appreciate I may well be cast asunder for this devilment, but, I'm intrigued to know who people have used (and what map) if they've had their 3.0i engine remapped.

I ask as clearly there's a degree of TPS programming going on, there's a noticable notch at just over 3k rpm, thereby convincing me I need to stay above that range in order to better mechanically appreciate the power delivery. I'm not really interested in gaining power per say, it's more about seeing what the standard/modified torque curves are like.

User avatar
jabber
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 3137
Joined: Mon Jul 05, 2010 9:23 am
Location: Hampshire

Remapping

Post by jabber » Thu Feb 22, 2018 6:59 pm

Not had my 3.0 remaped but once had my old 2.0 6 cylinder z3 remapped and it made a huge difference to the driving experience I don’t think there was much of a power increase 10bhp max ( including bespoke air intake ) but the car pulled much better through the rev range than without it
Z less again
14 E89 Z4 2.0 msport grey gone now
10 E89 Z4 3.0 Black auto now. Very sadly gone
Gone 04 E85 z4 3.0 Maldives blue smg

mjennings23
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 1176
Joined: Tue Mar 21, 2017 11:11 pm
Location: North West

Remapping

Post by mjennings23 » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:12 pm

If you're noticing a surge of power over 3k rpm then I'm betting your Vanos seals are gone. Get them sorted and it'll feel like a remap, restores all the lost torque in the low range that you'll never realise you were missing.

eddiemunster
Member
Member
Posts: 278
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:37 pm

Remapping

Post by eddiemunster » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:14 pm

mjennings23 wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:12 pmI'm betting your Vanos seals are gone.
What's involved in that/cost?

Edit - I checked the symptoms, mine doesn't have rough idle, poor MPG or throttle hesitation, just a surge of power around 3300rpm.

mjennings23
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 1176
Joined: Tue Mar 21, 2017 11:11 pm
Location: North West

Remapping

Post by mjennings23 » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:58 pm

eddiemunster wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:14 pm
mjennings23 wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:12 pmI'm betting your Vanos seals are gone.
What's involved in that/cost?

Edit - I checked the symptoms, mine doesn't have rough idle, poor MPG or throttle hesitation, just a surge of power around 3300rpm.
I'm assuming you have the M54 (pre-2006) as you stated 3.0i above.

I had none of those symptoms either, fact is the rubber BMW used will have perished by the time the car hit 30k miles. Get that done before considering a remap and you might be surprised.

If you're handy with spanners and make sure you have the correct tools, you'll have it done in a day easy.

eddiemunster
Member
Member
Posts: 278
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:37 pm

Remapping

Post by eddiemunster » Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:05 pm

mjennings23 wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:58 pmIf you're handy with spanners and make sure you have the correct tools, you'll have it done in a day easy.
I'd need to go to a dealer/specialist, I think the cost/work is going to be down to the company that sold me the car.

User avatar
MACK
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 3600
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2015 11:38 am
Location: Manchester

Remapping

Post by MACK » Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:27 pm

eddiemunster wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:05 pm
mjennings23 wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:58 pmIf you're handy with spanners and make sure you have the correct tools, you'll have it done in a day easy.
I'd need to go to a dealer/specialist, I think the cost/work is going to be down to the company that sold me the car.
I doubt you'll get a dealer to cover the cost on a vanos seals job. They don't usually throw a code so the dealer isn't going to think there's an issue.
Silver 05 3.0i SE
Mods inc - F/L Xenons Clear Ind Rear Lights M Sport Seats & Wheel Eibach/B4 3.64 DIFF (SOLD)

White E89 20i M Sport
Mods inc- B12 kit, M3 Arms, 18" Zito 935's with PS4's, Decat & Remap, Switchable Exhaust Flap (SOLD)

eddiemunster
Member
Member
Posts: 278
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:37 pm

Remapping

Post by eddiemunster » Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:33 pm

MACK wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:27 pmThey don't usually throw a code so the dealer isn't going to think there's an issue.
Worn synchros won't throw a code either, but a dealer will still be duty bound to repair them, as an example.

User avatar
Smartbear
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 13685
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2014 6:54 pm
Location: a barn in Somerset

Remapping

Post by Smartbear » Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:38 pm

eddiemunster wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:33 pm
MACK wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:27 pmThey don't usually throw a code so the dealer isn't going to think there's an issue.
Worn synchros won't throw a code either, but a dealer will still be duty bound to repair them, as an example.
That’s a bit different though, worn syncros aren’t normal wear & tear but the vanos seals are :?
Rob
Image

e89 Sdrive 20i, plenty of mumbo & good economy-the thinking bears z4
e89 Sdrive 30i, this ones busted, pass me another...
e85 3.0si sold

User avatar
MACK
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 3600
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2015 11:38 am
Location: Manchester

Remapping

Post by MACK » Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:44 pm

eddiemunster wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:33 pm
MACK wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:27 pmThey don't usually throw a code so the dealer isn't going to think there's an issue.
Worn synchros won't throw a code either, but a dealer will still be duty bound to repair them, as an example.
There not two compariable faults. Plus worn synchos are easily demonstrated to have failed. How exactly do you intend to demonstrate that you think the vanos seals arent in great shape to the dealer? Your literally going to be going in there and saying "I think my car feels a bit flat/underpowered and someone on the internet said it will be vanos seals"
There going to say two things, it runs fine and it drive fine.

That kind of sums up why sum 99% of M54 engine BMWs out there are running around with knackered vanos seals. They usually don't present with any running issues and all that happens is a gradual loss of low end torque even at very low mileage.
Last edited by MACK on Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Silver 05 3.0i SE
Mods inc - F/L Xenons Clear Ind Rear Lights M Sport Seats & Wheel Eibach/B4 3.64 DIFF (SOLD)

White E89 20i M Sport
Mods inc- B12 kit, M3 Arms, 18" Zito 935's with PS4's, Decat & Remap, Switchable Exhaust Flap (SOLD)

eddiemunster
Member
Member
Posts: 278
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:37 pm

Remapping

Post by eddiemunster » Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:54 pm

MACK wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:44 pm How exactly do you intend to demonstrate that you think the vanos seals arent in great shape to the dealer?
Easily, in the same way that I could say that my 330d feels as though it's not running properly, and then show that there's excessive end-float on the turbo which is limiting boost.

If the vanos seal has failed, and was failing at the point of sale, and removal/replacement of the same proves that to be the case, then legally speaking there's nothing to discuss with the dealer other than quantum.

User avatar
MACK
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 3600
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2015 11:38 am
Location: Manchester

Remapping

Post by MACK » Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:15 am

eddiemunster wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:54 pm
MACK wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:44 pm How exactly do you intend to demonstrate that you think the vanos seals arent in great shape to the dealer?
Easily, in the same way that I could say that my 330d feels as though it's not running properly, and then show that there's excessive end-float on the turbo which is limiting boost.

If the vanos seal has failed, and was failing at the point of sale, and removal/replacement of the same proves that to be the case, then legally speaking there's nothing to discuss with the dealer other than quantum.
Where's your evidence that a used part in a used vehicle had indeed failed to the point of needing repair/replacement rather than a bit of fair wear and tear. My point is you cant demonstrate that the worn seal was having a impact on the vehicle. It's the same as saying I've bought this car and discovered that after removing it the cam cover gasket rubber has hardened so I want the garage that sold the car to replace it. The first question anyone including a small claims court is going to ask is "how had it failed before you removed it?" Which of course can't be demonstrated.
Silver 05 3.0i SE
Mods inc - F/L Xenons Clear Ind Rear Lights M Sport Seats & Wheel Eibach/B4 3.64 DIFF (SOLD)

White E89 20i M Sport
Mods inc- B12 kit, M3 Arms, 18" Zito 935's with PS4's, Decat & Remap, Switchable Exhaust Flap (SOLD)

eddiemunster
Member
Member
Posts: 278
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:37 pm

Remapping

Post by eddiemunster » Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:29 am

MACK wrote: Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:15 amMy point is you cant demonstrate that the worn seal was having a impact on the vehicle
You can't easily demonstrate that a worn turbo seal was having an impact either, but you can prove that the seal was worn and therefore it wasn't operating correctly.

I know you're only trying to help, but, I don't need advice on how the law works, that has been my job for the last 20 years: what I need is a rough estimate of the cost of replacing the vanos seals.

Regards

Anmarube
Member
Member
Posts: 510
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2016 8:09 pm
Location: Atherstone, Warwickshire.

Remapping

Post by Anmarube » Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:25 am

Surely everything on the car has worn to a degree because of age and mileage. Personally I'm pretty sure this would be classed as fair wear and tear.. 30% worn tyres etc. Wouldn't expect to get them replaced FOC. Second hand car not classed as new so parts wear. Most parts are not operating as they were when new.
As for price on the Vanos some guys are saying a day. So days labour at local indie at say £45 per hour plus parts plus VAT.

eddiemunster
Member
Member
Posts: 278
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:37 pm

Remapping

Post by eddiemunster » Fri Feb 23, 2018 8:51 am

Anmarube wrote: Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:25 amSurely everything on the car has worn to a degree because of age and mileage.
Yes, everything is going to wear, but that doesn't necessarily change the responsibilities of the dealer: by using that argument they could effectively void every used car warranty they provide. The key is "fair wear and tear", and more importantly whether the issue was a material fact that's relevant at the point of sale.

However, the dealer accepted responsibility immediately, without question or comment, but he did ask that I try to find a more reasonable specialist to quote for the work, rather than a BMW main dealer, and I can't argue with that sentiment which is why I posted the question here.

Thanks for the rough estimate on the potential prices.

Post Reply