Z4-forum.com

Z4M-2006 wrote:See I can't understand that ...

I would save up and when I had the money I would buy it..I could wait, I wouldn't need it NOW!!

That said I would never buy a new car if that's what you mean?

To buy something for 40k and lose 40% of its value over a few years seems crazy to me,just to say I've got a new car?

To pay for finance ,and to get walloped for depreciation for the Sake of a car seems like getting kicked in both bollocks at the same time.

If you worried about depreciation then you wouldn't buy anything in life and its just something you have to stomach whether a car, TV, washing machine but there are ways of minimising depreciation on a car when buying new.

I take Lux's view, you can't take money with you once you've gone and as a new motor can give pleasure in life and you can afford it why settle for someones hand me down. I've had plenty of second hand cars in the past and as I'm pretty anal about condition etc I've never been 100% happy with a used buy. People simply don't look after cars these days. I tend to save a small deposit, keep the monthly payments reasonable and change for new on a regular basis knowing any probs that do crop up I don't have to worry about the expense etc.

The only other way I would do it is buy a really cheap new car and keep for 20 years so your maximising value for money but then ownership would become pretty boring, my Z3 being the exception

Tim.

Z4M-2006 wrote:See I can't understand that ...

I would save up and when I had the money I would buy it..I could wait, I wouldn't need it NOW!!

That said I would never buy a new car if that's what you mean?

To buy something for 40k and lose 40% of its value over a few years seems crazy to me,just to say I've got a new car?

To pay for finance ,and to get walloped for depreciation for the Sake of a car seems like getting kicked in both bollocks at the same time.

I completely agree with you.

Every car I've ever had I have paid for in cash. It's mine to do with what I like and I like the feeling of truly owning something.

I would buy a house with cash if it was even remotely possible. Being in a mortgaged house is no better than renting to me but it's a necessary evil. I think the way I feel about ownership stems from family tradition where due to inheritance most are comfortable enough not to worry about credit.

I think mortgages are slightly different, you need somewhere to live, you don't NEED a 40,50,70,100k car.. (well, sometimes i'm convinced that GT3 has my name on it..). And mortgage is preferable to renting, as its such a huge amount of money, and the resulting ownership of an asset that isn't depreciating (like a car would) is preferable to spending the same on someone ELSES mortgage.

WRT cars - i can understand both sides, i've ALWAYS been of the mindset that ownership is better - in the end you actually have something tangible for your outlay, vs essentially paying depreciation for someone else's later benefit.

I also understand the concept of having spare monthly income, and not huge lump sums to spend on things.. however with PCP etc, the one thing i dont grasp is that you're basically spending (lets say a 100k car) 30k over 3 years to then hand it back, and have nothing to show for your 30k except the period spent driving it. Upsides being newer, hopefully problems covered by warantee etc..

On the other hand, if you can save half the car, finance the second half and buy it a few years older .. say 60-70k car .. whilst yes you're financing some of it, but you have equity in the asset that is later (and really.. at any time for an emergency..) worth something you can reclaim if you wish.

These days - unless you have a job for life, i think people should be careful with long term finance, i personally like knowing i have an out option should the worst happen.

there is obviously some equation that compares the depreciation of an asset against the cost of the pcp etc, and obviously on new cars thats always basically going to be the same thing .. however nobody buys new cars for cash. So you want to compare ~a few years old car, against the PCP on the new equivalent. If depreciation is pretty bad, and you can PCP on a new vehicle for less.. i dont see what's wrong with PCP if you can afford it.

Time to go browse some PCP deals on brand new supercars...

So a £90k 991 911 C4S PCP deal lands you a £45k balloon payment, after £18k deposit + £1k/mo over 3 years. you're paying over £50k for 3 years of ownership.

Comparatively, private sale cars are ~£65k. If you bought at £90k new, you'd of paid £25k for your 3 years..

seems like a bum deal to me.


car sales: http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds? ... earTo=2015
finance example: http://www.porsche.com/uk/models/911/91 ... s/finance/

Im with Tim on this one.I have bought 70 new cars in my life and enjoyed everyone of them.Yes ,I have lost money,but as Tim says you can't take it with you,and Ive earned it so I spend it as I like.

In the example above, with HP you pay 2.65x on your monthlies & sell privately at £65000 to pay a total cost of £31500 for 3 years. So that's +£6'500 rather than +£25'000 on a cash purchase.

I didnt see any figures for HP, only PCP - did you work that out?

£2600+ monthly is quite a significant dent on your income


EDIT: Lombard provided a nice HP estimate, seems like a much better deal than PCP. I guess you're reliant on a dealer to buy your car and pay the finance early if you wanted to sell before the HP period ends though.

Yeah, I plumbed the numbers into an on-line HP estimator. The HP issue is it requires a fairly large lump of disposable income to throw at the monthlies. Depends on the agreement. Mine is pay off in full at any time and I pay what's owed + an extra months interest.

In my case I worked out for an average mile good condition car I was always in positive equity due to the discount & very large deposit (30% of the invoice cost)

rhys4 wrote:Im with Tim on this one.I have bought 70 new cars in my life and enjoyed everyone of them.Yes ,I have lost money,but as Tim says you can't take it with you,and Ive earned it so I spend it as I like.

Then you get to an age when you realise that you are into bonus time over the three score an ten!
My lounge is covered in new car brochures now

With PCPs you neede to be realistic, I certainly wouldn't use one to buy a 40/50k car but use it where you get a highish dealer contribution, I had 8k on the E89 and nearly 6K on the M135i and along with a lowish APR usually 4.9% then it can be relatively sheapish motoring. My PCP on the M135i was for 23K but realistically I'm paying less than half that as I won't be paying the ballon amount. I just don't like giving a dealer 30K or more of my own cash. Also if I did fall into financial difficulties in the future my money pot is still in the piggy bank and would just hand the car back and walk away.

End of the day its whether you like the smell of a new motor

Tim.

Like the smell of money as well!

The apr rate BMW offers on a new z4 is far better than what Porsche are offering. I purchased my z4 new 2 years ago on a 2% apr deal, I recently looked into a Porsche Macan but when I saw the whopping 8.9% apr I decided against it and kept my z4

ronk wrote:Like the smell of money as well!

I like the smell of both

Tim.

I'm going to have a look to see what makes financial sense.

Currently looking at a 330/335xd so do I :-

A) spend £30k cash and loose the paltry 3% and maybe pay myself back over three years? Or
B )take a deal and pay the Bmw finance house 5% interest (guessing) or more ?

The depreciation remains identical at about 17% / year over three years and I'm told that a dealer contribution would be available on either scenario.

Sorry if this drags the post even more way off track

rhys4 wrote:Im with Tim on this one.I have bought 70 new cars in my life and enjoyed everyone of them.Yes ,I have lost money,but as Tim says you can't take it with you,and Ive earned it so I spend it as I like.

70 new cars!!
I take it you get bored easily.
Whats the longest you have owned a car?