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First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Specific discussion about the E89 2009 Z4 (sDrive35is, sDrive35i, sDrive30i, sDrive23i)
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stuartinzg
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First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by stuartinzg » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:06 pm

I finally got around to buying the MHD Logging licence for the MHD N54 app in the Android store.

After much faffing with adapters which communicate to the car properly, extension cables, OTG cables and a Micro USB to USB-C adapter, plus the Brodit setup! I can finally get it talking to the car.

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I thought I would see how the engine is currently operating, lots more information here than I fully understand - but plan to research more and see what it all means - also posted on N54tech to see what the tuners have to say about the running rich/lumpy idle. Perhaps the 3rd gear pull will show something. No errors in the DME, 98 ron, recent service+new plugs.

Link to all the data(I think around 15 different readings)/interactive graph: http://datazap.me/u/stuartinzg/3rd-gear ... &data=4-21
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35iS, Black/Coral Red, 19" BBS CH-R/MPSS, Eiback Pro Springs, CoolCarbon Performance Pads, Golf T, Stubby, LED 80w halo's, X6 tips, CarPro CQuartz, Custom painted accessories

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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by stuartinzg » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:08 pm

You can see with the OEM set up, boost is only around 10-11 PSI peak, tailing off to 5~ PSI at near redline, hence why it feels like it runs out of puff. Most maps are increasing this to 14-15 PSI with less fall off for stage 1. Would explain where all that potential power comes from.
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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by R.E92 » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:29 pm

I've been running at 18PSI for a while now, whenever I go back to stock it feels like the turbos have been removed!

You want to add Cyl1 ignition timing into the log too. At the moment you just have the correction logged.
Power is raised by increasing both boost and timing advance.

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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by Maniac » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:37 pm

It's exactly that top rev range I wanted to enhance as it feels strangled. I wonder why the stock map tails the boost off...

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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by stuartinzg » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:38 pm

R.E92 wrote:I've been running at 18PSI for a while now, whenever I go back to stock it feels like the turbos have been removed!

You want to add Cyl1 ignition timing into the log too. At the moment you just have the correction logged.
Power is raised by increasing both boost and timing advance.
Good tip, thanks. I did try to add them to the logging but it would only let me add 2 more sensors and I didn't think just one cylinder ignition timing would be enough? What about the others? Should I swap sensors on runs?

18 PSI on stock turbos? Interesting, what sort of power increase did you get?
35iS, Black/Coral Red, 19" BBS CH-R/MPSS, Eiback Pro Springs, CoolCarbon Performance Pads, Golf T, Stubby, LED 80w halo's, X6 tips, CarPro CQuartz, Custom painted accessories

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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by stuartinzg » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:43 pm

Maniac wrote:It's exactly that top rev range I wanted to enhance as it feels strangled. I wonder why the stock map tails the boost off...
:thumbsup: One of the reasons I posted this was to give you some inspiration to see how simple it is when you do it yourself, since the advent of the Android apps for flashing. I did this logging without even touching the ECU/DME at all - zero risk and pretty interesting. Helps me to know what's going on under the hood.

I don't know why it tails off, perhaps other limitations in the car with cheaper components than the 1M? BMW may dial it back for reliability - you're the i not iS, so you will have another 40 bhp down too - with practically the same engine, that would be quite noticeable.

I have heard on the N54tech forums that we should upgrade our charge pipe (it's plastic and can leak under higher boost) and the intake as the very first steps. The OEM chargepipe can explode when older/brittle, even in stock form! These upgrades are cheap. Then it's intercooler and downpipes (race cats, the 1M has these - even though it has the same engine).

Once we get over those limitations then we have more air to play with and the IAT's won't go through the roof.

That's my theory!

Or maybe they don't want you gunning down the M3's !
35iS, Black/Coral Red, 19" BBS CH-R/MPSS, Eiback Pro Springs, CoolCarbon Performance Pads, Golf T, Stubby, LED 80w halo's, X6 tips, CarPro CQuartz, Custom painted accessories

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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by techathy » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:46 pm

The thing I find interesting is that the ECU is closing the throttle from 6100 rpm and up. Is this to maintain air velocity as the boost is rolled off or is it another restriction in place?
Current: '09 Lotus Evora Launch Edition
Previous: '13 BMW 120dx, '15 BMW z4 35iS

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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by stuartinzg » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:49 pm

techathy wrote:The thing I find interesting is that the ECU is closing the throttle from 6100 rpm and up. Is this to maintain air velocity as the boost is rolled off or is it another restriction in place?
I didn't see that, where do I look?
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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by Maniac » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:50 pm

It backs up my seat of the pants need to manually change up around 6k.

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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by stuartinzg » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:51 pm

techathy wrote:The thing I find interesting is that the ECU is closing the throttle from 6100 rpm and up. Is this to maintain air velocity as the boost is rolled off or is it another restriction in place?
I see it now - on all 3 runs (you can switch in the top left). That's very weird!

I wonder if it's because I have just run a throttle body reset adaptation? But I don't think so.
35iS, Black/Coral Red, 19" BBS CH-R/MPSS, Eiback Pro Springs, CoolCarbon Performance Pads, Golf T, Stubby, LED 80w halo's, X6 tips, CarPro CQuartz, Custom painted accessories

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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by techathy » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:51 pm

on the 3rd line,, 3rd item from the right
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Current: '09 Lotus Evora Launch Edition
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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by stuartinzg » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:53 pm

I would love to see logs from yours to compare ...
35iS, Black/Coral Red, 19" BBS CH-R/MPSS, Eiback Pro Springs, CoolCarbon Performance Pads, Golf T, Stubby, LED 80w halo's, X6 tips, CarPro CQuartz, Custom painted accessories

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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by techathy » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:55 pm

When I was mapping the Sei' my turbo started to go off-boost over the last 1500 rpm of the rev-range. Counter intuitively, closing the throttle actually increased power a bit as it maintained air velocity into the engine. Without actually getting into mapping I don't know of a way to work out what's happening.
Current: '09 Lotus Evora Launch Edition
Previous: '13 BMW 120dx, '15 BMW z4 35iS

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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by stuartinzg » Sat Feb 06, 2016 8:05 pm

Sei' ?

Yes, the more I read into mapping the more complex it becomes. Various tables and maps overlaying, it isn't just a single table/map but many many factors and sensors all coming together to provide the end result... I'm involved in complex software at work and it's very similar in some respects to an insurance rating engine (or an aggregation engine in fact, many rating values)-in that you have matrices and then inputs, which provides a value to part of an equation. But this DME has hundreds of tables, overlaying each other, with various matrices and data coming in continuously from the sensors. Everything has to operate within a "range", a bit like the range in the suspension settings - then it adapts and changes vanos, throttle, fuel, air, boost, timing, and various others, in order to pull it "back" into the range and "target".

I'm also guessing this is why drive by wire helps the engineers, because it's only a "target" rather than an absolute. They wouldn't be able to make that adjustment if it was hard wired into the throttle body.

Complex stuff when you're a rookie looking in from the outside without years of full time experience.
35iS, Black/Coral Red, 19" BBS CH-R/MPSS, Eiback Pro Springs, CoolCarbon Performance Pads, Golf T, Stubby, LED 80w halo's, X6 tips, CarPro CQuartz, Custom painted accessories

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Re: First MHD Logging results (OEM BMW map)

Post by techathy » Sat Feb 06, 2016 8:28 pm

Fiat Seicento... I went so far that the OE simply ran out of table resolution so moved to an aftermarket ECU & mapped the engine from scratch.
Current: '09 Lotus Evora Launch Edition
Previous: '13 BMW 120dx, '15 BMW z4 35iS

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